ARE MUSICIANS OVERPAID AND NOT COMMITTED TO THE LOCAL CHURCH?

[DR.Marietta Brown]

This is a subject that is discussed with most Pastors that we meet. Please share your honest thoughts.

[Zoey "Zozo" Kassay Solomon]

I think many are

Often when I visit churches the band, when not playing, are usually huddled by their instruments talking and joking around with each other during the service. Funny stuff but a huge sign of not being committed

[Erik Ali Norman II]

I personally think that musicians should'nt get paid if they are really doing their work for the lord. I refuse to accept anything form my church for the simple fact that I want my heavenly reward, and not my earthly reward. Musicians are overpayed, and when they get paid a large sum of lmoney, they begin to boast about how they can play, but what SOME musicians fail to realize is if the Lord give it to you, the Lord can take it away.

[DR.Marietta Brown]

Thanks for your commenst Erik Ali Norman II. We have comments below today. Thanks

[Pastor E.W. DennarD II]

Erik being a musician(and you are)I know that you understand that a lot of time and effort goes into being a minister of music.Like the pastor,he is a very vital part of the church.The musicians control the mood and tone of the worship service.An annointed musician can even make the difference in church membership."the workman is worthy of his hire".
lol great topic

[Dr. Carol L. Lawrence]

To say that musicians are overpaid is painting with too broad a brush. I'm sure their salaries vary from church to church. I appreciate their gift and I'm keenly aware of the invaluable role they play in the ministry of worship. My only wish is that their charge would be consistent with what the church can afford. The mega churches can afford to pay and that's a blessing. So many churches have no musician at all, or are forced to hire poorly talented musicians because the church budget can't support a really good musician. Some use CDs but that really just doesn't get it.

I'm not suggesting that musicians should not be paid, I think they definitely should. Perhaps they might consider offering their gift as a contribution to the kingdom, by using a sliding scale, so to speak. A good musician is one of the keys to church growth. As the church grows, so does the salary.

I don't have the answer to this. I just know that music is some churches is absolutely awful because the price for a good musician is just too high. What do you think the will of God is for these churches?

[James L. Brown]

I would like to give some insight on what I think is being stongly misrepresented. All musicians are not getting the salaries that you all seem to think we are getting, actually we not being compensated enough. Let me address a few things that are being wrongly attributed to us as musicians...

1. We play for the Glory of God and in the process of doing that, God is providing for us the means and resources to continue to do what we love to do which is to minister in music and be compensated fairly in the process..(our gift will make room for us)

2 We are counted on to do alot of things for the church which we should be compensated for...this has nothing to do with our motives or our relationship with God being put under scrutiny, musicians can be the most disrespected leaders in most congregations, most of the time the only concern about out well being is "are we on our post?" We get few off days to just enjoy life and family.

3 Let's look realistictly at what is required of us in most places....play for sunday school, bible study, prayer meeting, morning worship, evening worship, saturday worship (some places) then you have your various assortment of choirs youth, male chorus, adult, mass , praise team, sun beam, and any other choir you can come up with (do we really need that many choirs?), then we have to prepare songs for each rehearsal whether choir members decide to show up or not, then we have annual musicals for each choir, plus easter productions, christmas productions, weddings (that people don't want to pay you for), funerals ( that most churches try to include in our salary while the preacher gets his fee, (on top of his salary), 3,5,7 day revivals, conferences that require singing by the way, plus musician rehearsals, and what about practice time..that needs to be factored in. and you say we are over paid? I disagree strongly!

4 (Worthy) Musicians deserve every cent they get for all that they have to put up with, on top of all the responsibilty that is given to us, If the church would value musicians more and stop treating them like the hired help, you would definitely see a greater decrease in the amount of vacant churches that are sadly left with having to sing to song tracks and karaoke systems. No church should have to suffer like that but if they do not recognize that this is a lively hood as well as a calling on our lives it will probably still remain in the current state that it's in....(didn't the bible say God is not the author of confusion?)

I hope we are reaching a point and time where we as musicians and pastors look to re-evaluate the way we determine what is fair and what is right for all parties involved, that way no one feels like they are getting taken advantage of and in the process we can look to heal some of these wounds and misconceptions all around. Any relationship requires respect, trust, honesty, and communication, loyalty is supposed to be equally shared, I say that if your church can't pay the salary that we require, find other ways or perks to supplement the lack there-of for example...offer to have an appreciation service for them, or how about a christmas bonus, paid vacation time, or whatever logical remedy will suffice. Do something.....something will always be better than nothing....sometimes it's the thought that counts. I have played for free and played when I thought I was gonna get paid but didn't also, there is a difference between being nice and being taken for a ride. I have to say this in all of my years of playing I have truly discoverd if you don't look out for yourself no one else will, don't believe me? get sick or ask somebody for help with something and see how many people are willing to come to your aide......now I know God is my provider and he will supply my needs, but you just can't let anybody treat you any kind of way...just like the church has standards for what they will and will not accept in contrast we as musicians also have certain standards inplace for what we will and will not accept also. There is give and take on both sides....seek God and pray and he will direct our paths.....we just have to stop all this leaning in the wrong directions....because the church is suffering because of it. It's time for change.....(smile)

[DR.Marietta Brown]

The Church as a whole has to look at the Business of the Church and restructure that . A lot of Pastors can attest to what Mr. Brown says. Pastors are taken advantage of, they loose there families there homes , marriages ,children ,possessions and many times there health and life. Many Pastors have no health or life insurance,. It has taken me 24 years serving two Pastors and 10 years as a Senior Pastor to understand the word balance in the body of Christ. and to structure the business end of Ministry and I am an Accountant for over 30 years .. Just like we as Pastors have someone prepare the Churches calender, we need to prepare and plan for the finances of the Church, salaries and etc. We have no problem paying a Musician that is committed and works hard and brings to the Music Ministry what is needed and necessary. The problem is many Pastors pay Musicians and. they are not paid and if they are paid they pay more to the Musicians than they make. No CEO of a Company will pay a worker more than they make. Many Musicians run in the door , play never committ to there Church or a Pastor, never pray and live any kind of life, thats what we started this blog to discuss. I alway felt you make your place in the Kingdom of God and the World. Jobs are not given they are earned and many times created.We have no problem paying our Musicians , I just ask the people every Sunday to donate extra for the Musicians and they do and they are paid well . As a Pastor all we have to do is approve the music and they do the rest and it is a blessing.We have a family and they are all Musicians and the father is one and he teaches and works with them and my personal administrator works with them to make sure our Music is taken care of an excellent and annoited and Ministers to the people at each service.. It took years and much prayer and fasting and confessing the word of God for this type of Music Ministry.We have other people that work hard in the Ministry . How do we pay some and not the others.? What happened to serving in the House Of the Lord. No one can compare there position to the Senior Pastor it cant compare they have to have the oversight for the whole Ministry. Lets hear your comments.

[Min. Tullyvan]

Bravo! James L. Brown. Praise The Lord. Thank you for your post.
To all those musicians who are capable and committed; my hat is off to you.
I've served as a church musician for over 25 years. I've seen and heard a lot. Though my good days still outweigh my bad days; I have to say that the worst grief that I've experience, came from churches. I was raised to be appreciative for what is given and not have a set amount for compensation. I was told by my parents and grandparents to serve as unto the Lord and that my reward is in Heaven. I was pastored by my dad to be dedicated and consecrated. I have been classically trained to read all varieties of music and creatively taught to flow in the spirit of divine outpouring. I've even been mentored by many skillful and accomplished ministers / musicians to be well rehearse, well versed and all that the assignment called me to be.

As I survey it all, I say to God be the glory. I prayed for this ability and God gave it to me.
Before all preachers start clapping, allow me to say, I will not be pimped anymore. I'll serve till the setting of the sun; but I have a life and a family who needs me after the benediction. I have learned to charge in the same way that Wal-Mart does. What I offer may be at a discount, but it cannot be for free. Think of the chaos on Christmas morning at Wal-Mart when the 1st 100 people can get something for free. Now, multipy that all the things that church folk would ask musicians to do; if they did not charge. We have to charge. When I get ghetto fabulous or unorganized wedding request; I charge them tripple so that they are encouraged to find somebody else. LOL. I have been battered but am not bitter. Prayerfully, I'm wiser with a sense of humor. One has to be able to step back and not take himself too seriously. I try to stay away from those things and those people who tend to make my Bi Polar come out. Amen.

There is a remnant who are called and committed, and far too many times we are lumped into the same category as those who aren't called or committed. My heart goes out to all churches who are without a good musician and I also feel a debt of gratitude for all musicians who have been at there post for 20-25; and some for 30 plus years. I am so blessed to have crossed your pathway. To all church: If you want a good musician, remain prayerful. Find out and figure what you need he/her to do.[a basic job description] Be realistic. Be clear and be fair.

If you want someone who knows hymn and can read music? Then that's someone who has been trained, or can be in charge, or can teach music or voice; and have probably spent many hours of preparation and thousands of dollars to get where they are in music. Be willing to compensate them for their time. Don't degrade them or belittle their accomplishments. You would never acquire a healthy and happy spouse with these methods; so why would this be used in ministry is beyond me. Again, I have seen and heard a lot.

If you want someone who is not trained to be spiritually effective but can play the top 40 by ear, give them the list and let them know rehearsal days, the level of service obligations, behavior expectations and be willing to compensate them for their time. Don't degrade or belittle them. If there are corrective issues, there is a way to do it. Never publically. Don't spiritualize this into rebuking a problem. This is foolish and unwise. Communicate what is needed and then step back and allow the musician to do his/her job. Give constructive feedback regularly in a spiritual and professional manner. I you talk to a person like he's an idiot, then there is no wonder if he acts like one. I threw that in for free. I sincerely believe in doing all things decently and in order.

We are all aware of choir rehearsal time, worship services and special engagements, but don't forget about the many invisible hours spent in private preparation. If you cannot afford to pay what a musician is asking for, cheerfully tell them what you can do. Ask them to work with you.
If they have what it takes [giftedness, skillfullness, effectiveness] or potential, my advice would be for those in charge to embrace them. Reach out to them. Love and encourage them. At the end of the day, everybody wants to be loved and appreciated. If you [the church] would love the individual and appreciate the contributions, communicate goals and visions; I believe whole heartedly that things would be done differently.

The standards for church music and musicians have been lowered and some on both sides don't know what stardards are or use to be. But through fervant prayer, faithful actions and good conversations, we can turn the corner and make a noticeable difference in our local churches and gospel community. Neither side should ever give up. Neither side should ever take the other for granted. Neither side should ever get so frustrated with the other that we disrespect the other. Because in doing so, we make a mockery out of ministry.
Thank you and God bless you.

[Ebony moore]

I am not a Musician...and I understand your sentiments and agree wholeheartedly!!!
Know your value and your worth...we pay for our education, and some may have Student Loans.

[DR.Marietta Brown]

Great points Dr. Lawrence, we have commented a few minutes past. Thanks for your comments . and read the comments below.

[James L. Brown]

Dr. Brown I stand in agreement with alot of what you are saying. I think it is paramount that all Pastors take a hands on approach to what is going on in the music ministry so that there can be a more united front which in result of that would let the Music Ministry know as a whole that the staff is being fully supported by the Pastor and also to allow the Pastor to see what exactly is going on with one of the most focal points in the church I think being hands on alittle more would lessen alot of drama and confusion that choirs face today. As things stand today in most churches there is little account ability for the conduct of the choir because there is no reinforcement from the Pastorial leadership of the church.

And it would also bolster the accountability of the Music staff to the Pastor and the staff of the music department to the Minister of Music. It is hard to hold people accountable when you do not have the support of the Leadership. Let me also restate my position that I in no way am trying to compare my position to that of a Pastor, because there really is no comparison but I am standing firm that my position in the overall structure of ministry should not be looked upon as just an ordinary assignment. We as the music ministry are the front line against the devil and his imps and we are charged with a dutiful task every week to help create an worshipful environment so that the anointing of God may be able to flow freely and the Man or Woman of God be able to minister to the flock who's hearts and minds are in tune to his presence and his instructions.

Dr. Brown from what I am reading in your comments you to me seem like you get it....! Working hand in hand to accomplish the will of God in unity and harmony with your staff is becoming rare these days because most pastors like to micro-manage, now dont misunderstand I know Pastors are pulled on all the time but a visit everyonce in a while can go along way to keeping the lines of communication open and confusion to a minimum. Most Pastors meet with their Ministers on a weekly basis if I'm not mistaken, Is it that much more to ask to meet with your music staff at least monthly to address concerns or situations that need attention , because as we musicians tend to discover nothing gets done pretty much until the Pastor initiates an order of instruction as it should be in most cases. There is definitely alot of hard working people in the church that deserve to be compensated for their time also, but I only addressed the musicians because the topic of this discussion was calling us out, I just wanted to lend my perspective on this subject matter, I in no way intend to be offensive or disrespectful to any men or women of the cloth, but as God's musician I am obligated to debate an issue like this when I feel that alot of people's perception about what we do and the importance of what we do is being looked apon as if it is insignificant or irrelevant ..I'm sure Dr. Brown you will agree that err'body cant't just be up doing any and everything in your music department....there is a level of maturity, anointing and discernment that needs to be encompassed in your music ministry. (let the church say amend..!! lol)

[DR.Marietta Brown]

Minister James L . Brown. Thanks for your comments. I am really learning, Its great to hear directly from the Musicians and the Ministers of Music, We can understand there views. I am open to learn . This is great, we have read and continue to read every response.Thanks to you and everyone for there responses. If we could just talk like this in Church/ Ministry on every topic ,what healing ,that would come to the Body of Christ. Lets keep discussing.. Rather we agree on every point or not this has been great.