Is Today's Music Really Gospel?

[Dr. Wynelle Jordan-Alexander]

What happened to music with meaning, music that told a story, gave a testimony? Music that gave the listener just as much to consider about salvation and the condition of their soul as The Preached Word did? ...... Do we "really" need to "stomp", twist, jump all around, up & down to get the attention of young people today?..... Amazing Grace touched me at only 8yrs. of age, why can't that "same" Amazing Grace touch the hearts of the young today?.....Oh and by they way, I'm only 46....(Not old-old yet) :-).....What happened?

[Minister Paul Youngblood]

Well...praise Jesus..this could spark a national forum,because we witnessed the Gospel Music genre change so drastically over the years.....but my studies have indicated that in each generation,those who were at the forefront of the era..whether it was Thomas Dorsey,Mahalia Jackson,The Caravans,James Clevland,Walter Hawkins,Kirk Franklin,Jars of Clay,Michael W.Smith,the Winans...all of these would have been accused of "subverting the art form from the original"..all of the modern rhymthms and things that we hear now..came out of the Church.We have labeled what we do as"gospel music"but that is not always the case....musically.We have today put an untold amount of time and effort in the "music"and not the "message".The message of the Gospel is that Jesus is the Christ,He died for our sins,and he rose to secure our eternal salvation.Now whether or not that is the central theme in a lot of our music today,is very debatable.I speak from over 39 years of experience and working in Music Ministry,and I can tell you straight on,that with the proliferation of the secular recording indusrty discovering that gospel music is "marketable"things have changed.The days of the Choir marching down the middle aisle on Sunday Morning are all but GONE!!.Choirs are now getting ready for video shoots,concert promotions,and it might be said that these things are not all bad....but I think the focus as changed.24 hour gospel music stations are pumping and playing the music,congregations here that music,and they want the same music at their churches,so now Pastors are hard pressed to hire the best musicians that can keep it "crunk" with church demographics changing,my era...the Baby Bommers are now on their way out,and Generation X is now coming along and they want the new sound,and the new sound is akin to what they have experienced,so the days of the old auntie sitting at the upright piano playing "Precious Lord",Jesus is on the Mainline",all those ole "100's"and hymns..are sad to say...almost gone...the era of "praise and worship"(which is what I thought we were doing all along)is now at the forefront,so we have evolved from the older forms of where we started,to the almost studio-like precision of presenting "entertainment" that has very little substance.....if any.Jesus said..and ye shall know a tree by the fruit that it bears...unless we start back to putting the message of the Gospel back in our music......our current crop of fruit...will be rotten-Be Blessed

[Dr. Wynelle Jordan-Alexander]

GOD BLESS "YOU"!! Sis. Jackie, you have spoken my sediments "exactly"......And Yessss Minister Paul sparking a national forum is "exactly" what THE LORD intended when HE led me to start this discussion....I heard HIM asking in "my" spirit....Where is the REAL MESSAGE (as you mentioned) "exalting" ME in the music?....Where is the MEANING?....In whatever we do, whether it be to "preach", "teach", "pray", "praise" or YES, even "sing"....it ALL "must" be done TO and FOR the "GLORY" of Christ!!!.....And yes today's music has lost that and placed the focus (as again you stated) on the "music" and not the "man" that the music is supposed to glorify.....So I ask Min. Youngblood and my Sis. Collins....How do we get the "message" BACK in the music?....Oh yes we sing songs with words like (I'm gonna TAKE BACK what the devil stole from me)....But are we really??? -OR- Have we limited "taking back" only to the "material" and the spirit of "fear" keep us silent to what we KNOW is Kingdom "truth"?....Peace!

[Minister Paul Youngblood]

I read both comments from Sis.Alexander and Sis.Collins and I agree with you both,so I will attempt to answer how do we get the message back in the music.To start with,I sincerly believe that it starts with understanding what the Word is saying as it teaches us principles that we should adhere to.One of the biggest problems that we face today in Music Ministry is I think is the songs that we select,and by that...and I am speaking from experience..almost 40 years of experience....and this is going to set-off a powder keg among my fellow musicians,but I'm going to tell it like it is.Most musicians.....not all of them...but 95% of them deal with the music first...and then the message.Let me give you an example:I was at a workshop for writers,and I called them on the carpet for leaving certain lyrics in their songs to the whims and imaginations of the listner.One brother used the word "him"at least 16 times in the song and never "defined"who "him" was.Him...could have been to someone unsaved....somebody they were with the night before....if you get my drift...."Him'' COULD HAVE BEEN......ANOTHER "HIM".So my point is we need to have the message clearly defined and not leave it to chance that people know,or even understand who we are singing about.Secondly,we have begun to use and popularize certain phrases like"take back what the devil,stole from me"I don't personally agree with that because in the definition of the Biblical record...yes he is a thief,but not in the manner,or meaning that we attach to it,because if the Devil has anything that belongs to us,perchance we gave him 2 things to get whatever it was..number 1..we gave him "permission"...and number 2....we gave him the "power"..without those two,he can't steal anything,but....the songs lead us to believe that the devil came and broke in and robbed us, but the real truth is,if he stole our peace,if he stole our joy.more times than not...we HANDED IT TO HIM,IF IT IS THAT EASY FOR HIM TO GET...THEN YOU PROBALY DIDN'T HAVE IT IN THE FIRST PLACE.So fitting the message within the confines of sound Bible teaching is important.Last but not least.....and this is going to be hard to explain,but when it comes to the music......the problem is our music has become a hybrid,it is a combination of bits and pieces of everything that's out there.From a historical standpoint,the Church music of the 40's,50's,60's,70's are drastically different from what we here today.Back in the day...hymns like "How Firm A Foundation",Bringing In The Sheaves"A Mighty Fortress Is Our God'When We All Get To Heaven"meant something,and some of these songs were converted over from the Methodist Church and sung in Black Baptist Churches...but if you sung those types of songs in most churches today,the message gets lost but musically they don't "fit"the current genre',and theory wise a seventh chord,and a fifth,and a third,is the same,and will be the same until Jesus comes back...but because of commercial appeal,they have been "tweaked".Old gospel music,the kind that Mother Mayes played was nothing but 4 bar blues,with the lyrics changed from "baby,baby"to "Jesus,Jesus"and I don't advocate that we go back to that(It don't make no difference to me,cause I play all of it)but it begans in the heart of the worshipper,and when it's real....the Holy Ghost will breathe on it.So,we've got to stop doing things just because it sounds good,and press the issue of true worship.Listen when you get a chance,to what choirs sing,as opposed to what the Pastor is preaching..sometimes they are "worlds"apart...Jesus said:"A house divided against itself,cannot stand"-Be Blessed

[Minister Paul Youngblood]

You're correct Sis.Jackie...but the medicine that's needed is gonna be hard to swallow,because a lot of ministries have relied on doing things their way for so long,they will resist true change.Pastors are not going to sacrifice...and I use the word "sacrfice"because some of the things that are being done need to be "burned"and "consumed".Now let me look at the aftermath of this discussion that we have been having.A lot of people are going to see this,and they are going to automatically think that we are militiant about Gospel Music,and the people that are out there now,and I for one,am a part of those that are out there.As a matter of fact,I make my living from it.But the difference is,I was raised to do what I do.When you spend over half your life doing one particular thing,you get good at it.Secondly,it's not just a "living"but it "lives"in me.None of us are perfect by no means,but we strive everyday to get better,and closer to Christ.The medicine that we need is an outpouring of God's Spirit upon our lives.We would have less problems in this area,if we learn to let God lead us.I have personally turned down positions as Minister of Music at some churches because I knew it was not where God was leading me......I have turned down outrageous money.......good money.....lonnnggg money...because I refused to compromise my standing with God...and that you can't buy...I've been put out of churches because I refused to go along with a lot of things they were doing.Most young gospel artists find out very quickly that gospel music at a certain level becomes a business,because record companies are only interested in....SALES!!!! and if they have to pimp Jesus to get it done...they will do it.Yes you have to be compensated,yes you need this and you need that...but when a gospel artist starts demanding certain things like(and this is a well-known artist,so I won't put them on blast)they need a certain amount of fried chicken,fried a certain way,and be put up in only a four-star hotel...I mean,Cmon.....that is humanism,that's self,that's E.G.O.(EDGING GOD OUT)we have come to a sad state of affairs.The medicine is more Jesus,and less of us,whatever we do it needs to be done for the Glory of God,for the ongoing of His Kingdom,and to the ministering of souls to be saved,from the eternal fires of an everlasting Hell-Be Blessed

[Dr. Wynelle Jordan-Alexander]

GOD BLESS YOU "BOTH"!!....Yess, it seems we have a cure....question now is how do we get the remedy injected into the veins of the church?....It's going to have to "start" at the TOP!....As long as we have Pastors whose "only" concern is FINANCES....they are going to allow "anything" to INFECT our church's.....John 10:12 gives a description of a "hireling" (one who SEES the wolf..YET! leaves the sheep unprotected)....It's sad to say but a LARGE percentage of our pastors are guilty of this very thing today....As you stated Bro. Youngblood...the CHURCH has become a "Showcase of Stars" now...(paraphrasing)....But that's "exactly" what's going on.....Yess, the music and songs SOUND good and (for the moment)...they make you FEEL good....However in the lonnng run....they provide no "foundation" for a believer to "stand on" in times of adversity.....They allllllways to "back" to Precious Lord in times like that.....Today's music also provides very little "Keeping" power for the unbeliever...because soooon as the music stops and the Word goes forth....They tip out or go to sleep and when they get back home...they turn back to the secular radio station to find that same beat because they related it (in their mind at church)...to the Usher song, or the R.Kelly song, or the Beyonce' song......Oh yes, I would eeeeven dare to say that Our Lord is certainly not pleased with the state we've allowed "HIS" Kingdom to come to.....that's why He also proclaims in 1Cor.11:34 that there will be some things that HE will have to set IN ORDER when He comes!!!.....God has not given us a spirit of "fear" my brothers and sisters.....The time is NOW and The Lord is soooon to return and because He's soon to return....I feel a "shifting" in the atmosphere....God is getting HIS house "in order".....and as always it is OUR vessels He works through, so it's up to US to tell our brothers and sisters and eeeeven Pastors, Preachers, Teachers, Evangelists, and Apostles when they're going "contrary" to the order of Christ!!!!.....We as leaders MUST stand for what's TRUE and RIGHT or we WILL FALL!!!....and each time it will become more and more difficult for us to get back UP!!!....Peace!

[Eld. Harvey High]

Hi, I've read most of all these comments and stand in total agreement of getting back on track. I'm not a member-per-se of the GMWA but the L.A., Ca. chapter meets and practices at one of (my) churches. (I design, install, repair, maintain and operate sound systems for churches exclusively.)
The problem I've noticed is that the music has become the focus. I can't seem to get the musicians to play lower in volume so we can hear the choir and what they're saying. It's become a 'me, me, me! show!' I've explained this "phenomonon" to pastors and they agree with me but they are not willing to put their necks on the chopping block to tell the musicians to play a little softer. I've lowered the volume of the B3's & C3's, but come back next week to find they are back at full tilt again.
The drummer's are really big culprits in this stuggle also. Putting a plastic shield around the drummer doesn't help either. He'll play that much harder trying to get around the barrier. Any mic that is within 20 feet of the drummer will hear the drums over voices anyday! If we can get the musicians to understand that we are not there just to hear them do their thing, then we will have made 'a step' in the right direction. I have more to say about this but I'll let you digest this for right now. God Bless -Eld. High

[Minister Paul Youngblood]

Elder High...you are absolutley correct.And let me say for the record,and for the continuity of this discussion,that I as a musician have been guilty of playing too loud,and if all of us musicians would be honest and forthright.....at times we do.I have a tendency not to play as loud now because I concentrate so much now on the vocals,because the sound as to be "layered".In other words...the vocals should always be on "top"and everything else is a compliment to the vocals,and I have had a chance to be in churches that have the Avion systems and things of that nature,so it is getting better.Our music has a tendency to have a lot of energy,and vibe and exuberance,but it has to be tempered.And the Word talks about temperance and humility,and these elements need to be present in our music.One of the biggest tools that a Pastor can have,is to have someone skilled in working and shaping the sound "face"and sound "landscape"of the music.We have left the days of where the Pastor had the sound controls under the pulpit(there are still some places that have it like that)to "systems $150,000.00 and up...sometimes less is better.Because Pastors a lot of times are not taught what is best,they are left to their own personal whims that are not grounded in actual technical expertise'.When it comes to the Hammond organ,sound wise,I have used the Leslie 122 cabinet,with the guts out of a 147 cabinet,and even though the 122 cabinet is smaller,with the amp or "guts"out of the 147,it provides more than enough power for any Hammond B-3 or C-3 and it works excellent on even the "A" model Hammond organs.But as we have stated before,it all starts with our "focus".....what the primary issue is,and that issue is to help win souls for Christ,set the atmosphere for worship and praise,so that the Word can go forth unencumbered into the hearts and minds of the people.The only way this is going to happen is that you must have saved people willing to give themselves over to the dictates of the Holy Spirit.

[Minister Pamela D Groves]

I agree with Minister Collins that this is a great debate issue. I have mixed feelings regarding the use of the genre gospel with some of the music that is present in our churches. I feel that the tradition of the hymnals have gone and is now a mockery of the former glory that gave encouragement to a different generation. However, if the good news is preached in and through the music and people are being blessed by it then has it not accomplished the thing that it was supposed to do? I mean the Book of Solomon is a book of lover-to-lover. If taken at face value it is Solomon wooing his lady love. But, there are theologians that say that is God wooing the children of Israel. Who's version is to be believed?
I guess that remains true for the "gospel" music that we hear. "Never Would Have Made It"strikes a cord within me because of the burden of a sin-filled life that I previously lead.
I understand the song as a person that attempted suicide and other insane acts, the if it had not been for the Lord "carrying me thru my mess", that I would not be here today. I think that some song-writers (like me) write out of their hearts sometimes with the assumption that everyone has heard of the Jesus that I am excited about and that I am exalting.
I like "He Preparing Me" it talking about the things that I go through that He gets the glory of my process, but I think that the reason some songs take a special place in our lives has to do with the kindred relationship that we all have one to another and to our Jesus.
Yet, in some songs (I do apologize for this next statement if I offend any one) I think that fame and fortune is the key. They do not want to offend any potential buyer (regardless of religious belief) by having words that others may deem as discriminatory. The quest for fame and fortune has changed the face of music as we know it, but is that not also true with other aspects of our beliefs? I also agree on the maintaining of the integrity of the context of gospel music, but how to we go about encouraging others to feel as strongly about this topic as we feel?

[Minister Paul Youngblood]

Minister Pam...I agree with you in part......however,I don't think that writers should right out of the "assumption"that everyone has heard of the Jesus that you are writing about.Even in this day and age,there are whole religions that only believe that Jesus was no more,or in some cases no less than Budda,Mohammed,Confucious(OR MAYBE HIS MOMMA SHOULD HAVE NAMED HIM "CONFUSED)Ghandi,John Smith,Plato,or others that have been revered to be great "men",when in fact Jesus is "THE"Only Begotten Son of God,so that separates Him from all other.The other problem is just what you mentioned,we don't want to hurt anybodys feelings,and we want to encompass everybody that we can,and that's well and good,and it is a problem also....mainly because we have let the world dictate to us how we do what we do,and we have compromised our standards to be acceptable and palatable to everyone.God never said that the Church would finance itself through "cd sales"I believe with my whole heart that putting to use the gifts and talents that God has given you to reach the masses is wonderful,and yet I see so much of the "star mentality"amongst are gospel artists that it makes it difficult to see them no different from other superstars.If God has blessed you to attain that level of success,then you owe Him the humbleness to guard the gift He has given.Music is emotional...it comes from the center of our most spiritual area,the area of creativity,where art is born.But there is always the ego of man...and yes we all have them.Some of the most inflated egos on this planet are from musicians,Pastors,and preachers,bishops and elders,evangilists,and prophets....and I know this is going to strike a nerve with a whole lot of folk..and I hope it does,we have set a lot of these people up as "idols"and I ain't talking about "American Idols"either...I'm talking about false gods,and every false god that was ever mentioned in the Bible had no power,except the power that people gave them...and eventally.....they fell,and you are correct when you say that our hymnals are now gathering "dust"in favor of the "new sound".I know musicians who have Quit!!! I mean they have stopped playing for churches...because they couldn't keep up with the new contemporary music........congregations now want to be entertained,you know like that song they sang.."SHAKE IT FAST..WATCH YOURSELF!!!!,SHOW ME WHAT YA WORKIN WITH!!"OH YEAH!!! the days of those old standards are almost gone...but I promise you this.....the new sound......didn't soothe us,when times got hard,the new sound....ain't what those sisters sang when they went to pray for the sick,the new sound......ain't what brought us over from the plantation to the White House.....10 years from today...if we don't get a handle on this thing......."Stomp"will be sung at prayer meetings.But I'm reminded of a song that Andre' Crouch wrote years ago:"You ain't got to jump no pews....run down no aisle...no chills crawl down your spine....Cause I know...that I've been....Born Again".--Be Blessed

[Dr. Wynelle Jordan-Alexander]

Ewww Weee Ladies and Gentlemen....Glory To God!!!.....This has been a "wonderful" and "glorious" discussion for meee.....Again I feel blessed that The Lord encouraged this discussion and for the responses it has sparked.....Pastor Youngblood GOD BLESS "YOUUUU"....You have said such a mouthful and in your "last" response...Oh you "preached" that thang (yes thang) my brother......See, Jesus said these words in Matt. 10:33 (read that one if you like)...but again in another text, and it's the wording of the "same" text written in (Mark chap. 8 vs.38) that I personally like best...(For "whoever" is ashamed of me and "my words" in this ADULTEROUS and SINFUL generation, of HIM the Son of Man also will be ashamed when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels).....See where we're making our mistakes in the church of today is....preaching, teaching, praying, prophesying and yesss even "singing" TO ONE ANOTHER!!!.....and "that" is now why it's become nothing more than entertainment....there's no more ministering to the "LOST"......How many of us know that maybe a "song" may the the avenue The Lord might use to get a LOST person INTRODUCED to HIM and once they come...."THE TAUGHT WORD" will build the relationship?......Yes "I" may know what Marvin Sapp means by "Never Would Have Made It Without "YOU".....but as was stated in a previous response.....(who is the YOU?).....So to the LOST that would sound pretty "general" and may even raise that same question.....(who is YOU?).....and of course satan is laughing all the way to the bank (if you will) because HE"S succeeded AGAIN in getting us (yes even the church) to exclude the ONLY NAME under the sun by which man can be saved....JESUS!......We've X'd Him out of "Christ"mas (now it's Xmas)....We've deleted His prayer out of our schools.....What next?.....Soon we will no longer be -- "One Nation Under GOD!....Men and Women of God.....It's time out for the SHOW and it's now time to get back to the TRUTH!.....That with the HEART man(kind) "believes" and with the TONGUE he "confesses" that JESUS CHRIST "is" the Son of the LIVING God and that God did "raise" Him from the dead and He is now sitting at the right hand of the Father making "intercession" for us....as long as THIS is Done....(and MAINTAINED).."Thou Shall Be Saved"!!!!(Romans 10:9).....THIS is what we were called to do....NOT win Grammy's and Sammy's and any other whammy's.....Oh yes all that may come and (as said previously) - "has it's place".....(for your gift "will" make room for you).....I'm just saying that THAT should NOT be our "MAIN FOCUS"!!!!.....Let me close with this question....After allllll the stomping and romping and jumping and all that is done....Why are our churches half (if not more than half) -- still empty?.....May The Lord "add a blessing" to the readers, "hearers" and "doers" of HIS Word!!!

[Minister Paul Youngblood]

They are empty because people are tired of seeing the same thing in the Church,as they see in the world.The people that were in the Church left it empty because they missed the one thing that makes the Church "full"and that is the residence of the Holy Ghost filling us up.Instead,we end up like what happens when you eat nothing but junk food....you eatin..true...but you eatin the wrong thing and you are not getting the proper nutrition to sustain your body......so now you end up malnourished..you are eating....but you never get full.So is the same in the body of Christ.......we become weak......lifeless,with no strength,trying to live off of the new prosperity gospels,the aim at it,name it,and claim it,and the sad indictment is that most people have more faith in the foundation of the pew that they sit on every Sunday,than in the real "now"faith of Heb:11-1,after all the stomping,running,jumping,foaming at the mouth.when the smoke clears....we are right back at square one,we should be trying to help change lives,and effect change with what God has given us-Be Blessed

[Renaco Massenburg]

Greetings to all my brothers and sisters. I do believe that in some cases in today's music that are called "'Gospel '' it does lack of the name of Jesus Christ, Jehovah, and so on. But, as we all know. No man can judge us but God. Because in some cases, these musicians truly love God and believes they are doing what is right in his eyes. So if this is just a case about a labeled word of the meaning of what it should be. Then, alot of us would be in great trouble, if we live our lives without understanding everything. I believe once one is pure of heart, '' WHICH THAT IS THE ONLY THING THAT GOD SEES THAT MATTER'' then we should not look at what the music sounds like, and how much thee or thou you did not hear in it. Because as the bible says { Not all who says Lord lord will enter the Kingdom of God }. Music is universal, what may have gotten your attention back then, may not work for a new generation. Once the music is not misleading, then this case must be put to rest. Great debate though.