Genesis 3:1-6 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Genesis 3:9-20 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat? And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat. And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

1Timothy 2:7-15 Whereunto I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, (I speak the truth in Christ, and lie not;) a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity. I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting. In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works. Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobri

1Corinthians 11:3-10 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head. But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered. For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. For the man is not of the woman: but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.

Revelation 2:19-23 I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

Proverbs 7:4-27 Say unto wisdom, Thou art my sister; and call understanding thy kinswoman:
That they may keep thee from the strange woman, from the stranger which flattereth with her words.
For at the window of my house I looked through my casement,And beheld among the simple ones, I discerned among the youths, a young man void of understanding, Passing through the street near her corner; and he went the way to her house, In the twilight, in the evening, in the black and dark night:And, behold, there met him a woman with the attire of an harlot, and subtil of heart. (She is loud and stubborn; her feet abide not in her house:Now is she without, now in the streets, and lieth in wait at every corner.) So she caught him, and kissed him, and with an impudent face said unto him, I have peace offerings with me; this day have I payed my vows. Therefore came I forth to meet thee, diligently to seek thy face, and I have found thee. I have decked my bed with coverings of tapestry, with carved works, with fine linen of Egypt. I have perfumed my bed with myrrh, aloes, and cinnamon. Come, let us take our fill of love until the morning: let us solace ourselves with loves. For the goodman is not at home, he is gone a long journey: He hath taken a bag of money with him, and will come home at the day appointed. With her much fair speech she caused him to yield, with the flattering of her lips she forced him.He goeth after her straightway, as an ox goeth to the slaughter, or as a fool to the correction of the stocks; Till a dart strike through his liver; as a bird hasteth to the snare, and knoweth not that it is for his life. Hearken unto me now therefore, O ye children, and attend to the words of my mouth. Let not thine heart decline to her ways, go not astray in her paths. For she hath cast down many wounded: yea, many strong men have been slain by her.
Her house is the way to hell, going down to the chambers of death.

Proverbs 12:4 A virtuous woman is a crown to her husband: but she that maketh ashamed is as rottenness in his bones.

Proverbs 31:10-31 Who can find a virtuous woman? for her price is far above rubies. The heart of her husband doth safely trust in her, so that he shall have no need of spoil. She will do him good and not evil all the days of her life. She seeketh wool, and flax, and worketh willingly with her hands. She is like the merchants' ships; she bringeth her food from afar. She riseth also while it is yet night, and giveth meat to her household, and a portion to her maidens. She considereth a field, and buyeth it: with the fruit of her hands she planteth a vineyard.She girdeth her loins with strength, and strengtheneth her arms. She perceiveth that her merchandise is good: her candle goeth not out by night. She layeth her hands to the spindle, and her hands hold the distaff. She stretcheth out her hand to the poor; yea, she reacheth forth her hands to the needy. She is not afraid of the snow for her household: for all her household are clothed with scarlet. She maketh herself coverings of tapestry; her clothing is silk and purple. Her husband is known in the gates, when he sitteth among the elders of the land. She maketh fine linen, and selleth it; and delivereth girdles unto the merchant.
Strength and honour are her clothing; and she shall rejoice in time to come. She openeth her mouth with wisdom; and in her tongue is the law of kindness. She looketh well to the ways of her household, and eateth not the bread of idleness. Her children arise up, and call her blessed; her husband also, and he praiseth her. Many daughters have done virtuously, but thou excellest them all. Favour is deceitful, and beauty is vain: but a woman that feareth the LORD, she shall be praised.
Give her of the fruit of her hands; and let her own works praise her in the gates.

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If you don't read all the scriptures there, you will get no understanding.
I read all the scriptures . . .so, in summary, what are you saying?
This is a woman's place.

Not behind a pulpit, and not in any athoritarian position over a man.

She should also not be a harlot, but virtuous.
Genesis 3:1-6; 9-20 The Fall of Man; The Curse
>My Reply
I have repeatedly addressed Eve in previous discussions; most of them can be found under the discussions entitled: What is the Point of the Hebrew in Word, and Specifically the Garden Word in Genesis? Posted 10/16/09; “. . . and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.” (Genesis 3:16) Posted 04/14/09

1 Timothy 2:7-15 The Place and Dress of Women
My Reply
This was a letter of instructions written by Paul approximately A.D. 64 to Timothy, the church leaders and general members of the church in Ephesus. It is not unscriptural for a woman to want to be attractive. However, beauty begins inside a person. We could speculate that some of the women were trying to gain respect by looking beautiful rather than by becoming Christlike in character. In 1st Century Jewish culture, women were not allowed to study. Therefore, Paul did not want the Ephesian women to teach because they didn’t yet have enough knowledge or experience. The Ephesian church had a particular problem with false teachers, and evidently the women were especially susceptible to the false teachings because they did not have enough biblical knowledge to discern the truth. Paul was also telling Timothy not to put anyone (in this case, women) into a position of leadership who was not yet mature in the faith; the same principles apply to churches today.

Paul did not forbid women from ever teaching as seen by his commended co-work, Priscilla who taught Apollos, known as the great preacher (Acts 18:24-25). Paul frequently mentioned women who held positions of responsibility in the church such as Phoebe who worked in the church (Romans 16:1); Mary, Tryphena, Tryphosia and Persis were the Lord’s workers (Romans 16:6, 123) as were Euodia and Synthyche (Phil. 4:2). In Paul’s reference to women listening and learning quietly and submissively, he is speaking about an attitude of quietness and composure, not total silence.

In previous letters, Paul had discussed male/female roles in marriage (Eph. 5:21-23; Col. 3:18-19). Here he talks about male/female roles in the church. Just as Eve was deceived in the Garden of Eden, so were the women in the church who were also being deceived by false teachers. And just as Adam was the first human created by God, so the men in the church in Ephesus should be the first to speak and teach because they had more training. This view then, stresses that Paul’s teaching here is not universal but applied to churches with similar problems.

1 Corinthian 11:3-10 The Veiling of Women
My Reply
Paul was addressing the Corinthian church around A.D.55 Corinth was a major cosmopolitan city; it was also filled with idolatry and immorality. The church was largely made up of Gentiles. The matter of wearing hats or head coverings had become a big problem because two cultural backgrounds were colliding. Jewish women always covered their heads in worship. For a woman to uncover her head in public was a sign of loose morals. On the other hand, Greek women have been used to worshiping without head coverings. This letter also addresses te proper attitude and conduct in worship. While Paul’s specific instructions may be cultural (women covering their heads in worship), the principles behind them are directed towards respect for spouse, reverence and appropriateness in worship, and focus of all of life on God. If you are doing something that might easily offend members and divide the church, then change your ways to promote church unity. Paul told the women who were not wearing head coverings to wear them, not because it was a scriptural command, but because it kept the congregation from dividing over a petty issue and served only to take people’s mind off Christ. The phrase, “a woman is responsible to her husband” does not indicate the man’s control or supremacy bu rather his being her source. Because man was created first, the woman derives her existence from man, as man does from Christ and Christ from God. The principle behind Paul’s words is submission, which is a key element in the smooth functioning of any business, government, or family. God ordained submission in certain relationships to prevent chaos. It is essential to understand that submission is not surrender, withdrawal, or apathy. It does not mean inferiority because God created all people in his image and all have equal value. Submission is mutal commitment and cooperation.

Revelation 2:19-23 Message to the Church of Thyatira
My Reply
A woman in the church in Thyatira was teaching that immorality was not a serious matter for believers. Her name may have been Jezebel, or John may have used the name Jezebel to symbolize the kind of evil she was promoting. Jezebel, a pagan queen of Israel was considered the most evil woman who ever lived.

Proverbs 7:4-27 The Wiles of a Harlot
My Reply
Although this advice is directed to men, women can take heed as well. Without aim or direction, an empty life is unstable, vulnerable to temptations. Even though the young man in this passage doesn’t know where he is going, the immoral woman knows where she wants him. Notice her strategies: She is dressed to allure men; her approach is bold; she invites him over to her place; she cunningly answers his every objection; she persuades him with smooth talk; she traps him. There are steps to combat temptation. First guard your mind. Make sure your life is full of God’s word and wisdom.

Proverbs 12:4 The Virtuous Woman
My Reply
A virtuous woman elevates her husband; but the shameful wife brings ruin to him. In other words, the wife should never disrespect her husband, especially in public. Wherever he may appear to fall short, the wife should encourage him love and in the word.

Proverbs 31:10-31 The Characteristics of A Virtuous Woman
My Reply
These scriptures were taught to young Jewish girls as a means of teaching them the qualities and character God expected them to exhibit as a woman and wife. The secret this “virtuous woman” possessed was the wisdom to know when to get up before dawn and when to work through the night so she never lost her effectiveness. Her goals were clear and her motives were pure. She knew what her talents were and used them for everyone’s benefit. She wasn’t afraid of working with the business world but also supported her husband’s work. She was afraid of change or trying a new venture. She assumed the responsibilities of a Godly woman by teaching and giving, from her own hands to the poor. She didn’t produce all these qualities, talents, and business deals overnight but let God develop them within her, waiting for the appropriate opportunities to go where God led her.

What is this?????
An absolutely MOST Excellent post. Superb. Thank you Chaplain Pat.
Well, I do come from the complementarianism side of the debate, but the title of your thread is bordering on misogynistic.

Could I ask about Deborah?

God raised her up as a spiritual authority and judge over ALL of Israel.
Don't ask about Deborah. Deborah doesn't exist. She is but a figment of your imagination!! Deborah was a made up character created by the Roman Catholic Church!! Blame it all on Rome and the Pontiff!!

Get real people, women are anointed by GOD according to His will and purpose.

1 Samuel 3:18 "........And he said, It is the LORD: let him do what seemeth him good."

Acts 5:34-39 "Then stood there up one in the council, a Pharisee, named Gamaliel, a doctor of the law, had in reputation among all the people, and commanded to put the apostles forth a little space; And said unto them, Ye men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what ye intend to do as touching these men. For before these days rose up Theudas, boasting himself to be somebody; to whom a number of men, about four hundred, joined themselves: who was slain; and all, as many as obeyed him, were scattered, and brought to nought. After this man rose up Judas of Galilee in the days of the taxing, and drew away much people after him: he also perished; and all, even as many as obeyed him, were dispersed. And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought: But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God."
As someone once said:
"Women being ordained to the office of elder, is from the spirit of our modern age - it feels at liberty to correct God's Word."
It sweetly and seductively says: " shall NOT surely die..."
It sweetly and seductively says: What is written is not for you.
Good reply sister!!!
Deborah was a wise woman. She accomplished great amounts of work without direct involvement because she knew how to work through other people. She was able to see the big picture which enabled her to become a great mediator, adviser, and planner. She had great leadership skills and she had an extraordinary relationship with God. The insight and confidence God gave her placed her in a unique position. She was not power hungry; she wanted to serve God. Whenever praise came her way, she gave God the credit. She didn't deny or resist her position in the culture as a woman and wife, but she never allowed herself to be hindered by it either. God chooses leaders by His standards, not ours.


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