When seeing and attending the confirmation services of Bishops by an organization, I am seeing women who are being ordained as Bishops.  I have read and studied the office of Bishop and have not understood nor found any of the ceremonial ordinations of women as Bishops, nor in God's Word have I found anything on women as Bishops.

 

1 Timothy 3 is the specific chapter speaking on the Office and Qualifications of the Bishop.  Is a Bishop also an Overseer or Superintendent or Elder or Chief Elder? 

 

Now, the Word of God, KJV, states "...If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.  A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach; not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; one that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) Not as a novice [one newly come to the faith], lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil..."  1 Timothy 3:1-7

 

As the head of his household, he is to plan, protect, and provide for his household which includes stewardship as he "ruleth well his own house..." (Titus 1:7).  We are to follow the Shepherd and Bishop of our souls, Jesus Christ (1 Peter 2:25).

 

This scripture, literally, is speaking of a man.  Any thoughts?

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Loving it.....lol

 

 

I have two questions...just for the sake of argument:

(1) What if God did sanction the ordination of women to the office of bishop, how would you HONESTLY respond to this light?

(2) What if God did NOT sanction the ordination of women to the office of bishop, how would you HONESTLY respond to this light?

After reasoning this matter, you will come to find that it does not really matter what we think or how we feel about it. All that matters is what God wants. And we all know that He rarely want what we want. Let us focus on our own vocations, and remain in our own callings to be faithful unto death. For perilous times are upon us. We must prepare ourselves and our fellow man for a rapture that will not happen...ever, and a tribulation which is about to befall us such as we have never seen before in the history of the world.

I only meant, we are taught of a rapture which shall occur before the great tribulation period to whisk us away so that we will not have to suffer it. This is The great false hope that the enemy has filtered into our teachings for centuries. Not only is this believed in our black churches, but in our white churches as well. You and I both know that the Bible never speaks of a rapture. There's a first and second resurrection, but these are not a rapture. The church will not be taken out of the earth. We will be right here. It is a whole different subject and lengthy at best, but if you want to delve into it I am obliged to do so. We must stop lying to people and tell them the truth so that they will be prepared when that great and terrible day comes.

I like you Rev. Watson. I like you a lot. I am intrigued by your candor, and your interest as well. I accept your invitation and would be happy to respond to your up and coming thread regarding this subject matter. It promises to prove quite interesting. I shall start compiling my arsenal promptly.

Your brother in Christ, Pastor King

Apostle Greene,

 

I am using Prechers Network as a tool to learn.  Not for anything else.  When I asked the question it was based on what my learning has come to thus far.  Beyond the date that the post was presented, knowledge has been placed with me with the authority of the Word of God and my understanding has increased.  I am not an authority on anything.  However, being a Disciple of Jesus Christ is a life-long task.  And, if I can learn from brothers and sisters in Christ through this media, then I accept and receive that teaching relying on the Holy Spirit to guide.  Those of you who are or who have studied through the technicalities of man's commentaries, thoughts, apologetics, etc. appear to be in-sensed with us who are not as learned.  Please, forgive me for receiving knowledge and understanding fro God's Word...

 

Thanks for your comment...

A bishop is just another term for Pastor; Overseers are regarded as Apostles...........if correctly defined.

How? One scripture mentions "And I will give you pastors (shepherds) according to my heart, which shall feed you with knowledge and understanding" (Jer. 3:15) and the other mention 1 Timothy 3:2 says if a man desire the office of a bishop (overseer {by definition}/elder {Titus 1:5-11}).

 

Elders were in the old testament and we saw their role, it did not change, just more names were added such as Bishop and Overseer.

 

Pastors were in the old testament and we saw their role, it has not changed. Moses had elders under him to help him with his congregation, what did that make Moses? A shepherd of some form? Yes.

 

True, Apostles are Overseers (I agree with that whole-heartedly)-just not in the sense of what people make them out to be today. Bishop by definition is overseer, but we know they (apostles & bishops) have similar assignments, but not complete same just as Pastors and Bishops assignments are similar, but are different..such as with the rest of the positions..all hold some similarity.

  • Elder = Overseer. The bible calls the leaders at Ephesus "elders" and then "overseers" in the same passage. "And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders [presbuterous] of the church." (Acts 20:17) "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers [episkopous], to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood." (Acts 20:28)
  • Bishop = Overseer. The same Greek word translated as "overseers" in Acts 20:28 is elsewhere translated "bishop." "Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops [episkopois] and deacons" (Php. 1:1)
  • Elder = Shepherd? Peter addresses "elders" directly in his epistle, and then remarks that they should be motivated by the knowledge that the chief shepherd [archipoimēn] will reward them. This at least implies that elders [presbyteros] are also shepherds [poimen]; the under-shepherds working under the authority of the chief Shepherd.
  • Shepherd = Pastor. The same Hebrew word [ra`ah] is translated alternately "shepherd" (eg, Is. 63:11) and "pastor" (eg, Jer. 17:16).

Therefore, I'm not so certain that there are real biblical distinctions between pastors, shepherds, bishops, elders, and overseers. However, "apostle" [apostolos] is altogether distinct. In Acts 15, for example, the joining of the "apostles and elders" is repeatedly referenced. And, of course, in Ephesians 4:11, the apostles and pastors are listed separately as gifts to the church.

Good comment JG, my interpretation and view on this issue is the same. And I believe in Acts 20:28 Paul was setting the elders up to succeed the apostles. I don't see him calling others to be apostles as they were and to succeed them as apostles. At the core of the definition of an apostle, an apostle is a sent one, sent with a message, and is given authority from the sender. In Hebrews 3:1 Jesus is even called an apostle because he was faithful to God who had sent him. After the death of the apostles I believe the pastors are the successors and overseers of local congregations. The hierarchy in the church where bishops are concerned came from episcopalianism. You know... The apostle, then the bishop, then the pastor, and so on. These aren't titles of nobility or rank. I don't see this in scripture, but we do see it in Catholocism. And that's why people like Luther and Calvin sought to reform.  I see the two offices of the church being the pastor and the deacon in scripture. And notice apostle is listed after the given name. Paul an apostle, Philip the evangelist. Because it was their work, not their title. Paul told Timothy to do the "work" of an evangelist, not wear the title of an evangelist. As far as the above comment on there is neither male or female, Jew or Greek in Christ. Galatians 3 is talking about being free from the law. Jesus removed the wall of partition that kept certain people from God. In grace the Jew and the gentile, male and female all have to believe in Christ. There is no respect of persons in salvation by grace. In a marriage the woman still has her individual role as a female. As far as leadership in the church I think I think in Paul's day it was more of an issue of danger for women. That's why I believe he wasn't married. Today in America the church and its leaders don't face the dangers of persecution like they did. I think if we did women wouldn't desire to be pastors, apostles etc... Many men probably wouldn't either. But Christianity has become a laid back free for all in America. Its not so in other countries. Peace.  

Yes I am, Jesus used them to establish the foundation of the church by being the initial messengers according to Ephesians 2:20 and 1 Corinthians 12:28. They had a special authority to ordain elders to oversee the churches, set order in the churches, and write scripture. That work is done. He says if a man desires to be a bishop/overseer/pastor/, he desires a good work. I believe the pastor has been given the duty and responsibility to make disciples and gather God's flock in local areas and oversee them. I don't see Paul and Barnabas' type of apostleship in action today. Show me an example today as shown in the book of Acts.

LOL... I know my brother. And Martin Luther and John Calvin were a minority when they challenged the Roman Catholic Church for their errors in belief and practices. Today's church is much like the RCC. We disire titles, outward gifts instead of inward change. And are always seeking to take advantage of the peoples ignorance. Especially when it comes to money and control. Nothing different from the RCC. I've been attacked for my view on "tongues" as well. People don't study church history or the history between God and his people from the OT to the NT closely enough to know that God used different things and different people for different times for different reasons concerning his divine will. We don't need to continuing doing alot of the things that we do today. But many of us try to mimmick old things because we think it makes us more spiritual or closer to God. I can go on and on with this brother. LOL... Peace and thanks for you wall post.

I'll look at it some time today.

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