Should Ordination Require Seminary or Bible College? - Black Preaching Network2024-03-29T11:29:37Zhttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/forum/topics/should-ordination-require?groupUrl=njitscorrespondencebibleschool&commentId=916966%3AComment%3A932183&groupId=916966%3AGroup%3A898844&feed=yes&xn_auth=noMicah
You are right on! How…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2010-06-25:916966:Comment:13863622010-06-25T16:13:13.944ZDarren Lamar Maclairehttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/DarrenLamarMaclaire
Micah<br />
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You are right on! How could a Pastor/Minister NOT study the Greek or Hebrew on a Bible College Level and even be considered seriously as a teacher/pastor? That should be a Basic requirement!!!<br />
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My brother in Law is attending World Harvest Bible College (now Valor Bible College) and is not only getting grounded in the WORD but is being forced to read, speak, and write on a professional level. That is what it is all about...TRAINING! Not just being able to talk a good game and twist the…
Micah<br />
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You are right on! How could a Pastor/Minister NOT study the Greek or Hebrew on a Bible College Level and even be considered seriously as a teacher/pastor? That should be a Basic requirement!!!<br />
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My brother in Law is attending World Harvest Bible College (now Valor Bible College) and is not only getting grounded in the WORD but is being forced to read, speak, and write on a professional level. That is what it is all about...TRAINING! Not just being able to talk a good game and twist the Word to fit your own version of the Gospel.<br />
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This is what is needed in our leaders. Oratory skills without intelligence and education refining the mind is USELESS. Brother...you said it MUCH be…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2010-06-25:916966:Comment:13863182010-06-25T16:04:40.888ZDarren Lamar Maclairehttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/DarrenLamarMaclaire
Brother...you said it MUCH better than I could ever. There are forces at work that want to paint all Black Church going folk as Ignorant and Unlettered who will follow any or all religious con men blindly.<br />
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Allowing Ministers or Pastors to pontificate before our community WITHOUT being educated totally in the Word is foolhardy. That is a disservice to all of us and to keep it real...looks bad on our people.<br />
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Maybe there would not be so many of these jive Spiritual Snake Oil salesman fleecing…
Brother...you said it MUCH better than I could ever. There are forces at work that want to paint all Black Church going folk as Ignorant and Unlettered who will follow any or all religious con men blindly.<br />
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Allowing Ministers or Pastors to pontificate before our community WITHOUT being educated totally in the Word is foolhardy. That is a disservice to all of us and to keep it real...looks bad on our people.<br />
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Maybe there would not be so many of these jive Spiritual Snake Oil salesman fleecing our people if we had a DEFINITIVE STANDARD for ALL Black Ministers - whatever denomination. So true, I've seen it too. I…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-17:916966:Comment:9352992009-08-17T01:14:59.035ZRobert A. Day, Sr.https://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/RobertADaySr
So true, I've seen it too. I also believe a foundation in the leadership and management arena are paramount for an ordained minister to have in his or her arsenal. Bro Rob Day
So true, I've seen it too. I also believe a foundation in the leadership and management arena are paramount for an ordained minister to have in his or her arsenal. Bro Rob Day Dr. Butts, at no disrespect t…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-17:916966:Comment:9352862009-08-17T00:38:34.878ZRobert A. Day, Sr.https://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/RobertADaySr
Dr. Butts, at no disrespect to you, I want to be clear in my explanation. 1.) I don’t think college or seminary should be a requirement for ordination of God, but of man with the God-given power to ordain to really consider it instead. 2.) I wish college or seminary was a requirement for man in every denomination and non-denominational setting, but I know it will never be across the board. 3.) I appreciate your explanation of ordination giving the rights to us to participate in the sacraments…
Dr. Butts, at no disrespect to you, I want to be clear in my explanation. 1.) I don’t think college or seminary should be a requirement for ordination of God, but of man with the God-given power to ordain to really consider it instead. 2.) I wish college or seminary was a requirement for man in every denomination and non-denominational setting, but I know it will never be across the board. 3.) I appreciate your explanation of ordination giving the rights to us to participate in the sacraments of the church. That brings it home for me. 4.) I just know that I want to do my best in ministry and for “me” (not all ministers) that’s doing all I can to improve for God and for the people. 5.) I do believe that the Spirit gives life and comes first. However, I also believe that the Word is Spirit and life too (Jn 6:33 & 63) 6.) Before I knew about bible college or seminary, as a child I thought there weren’t too many people on earth who knew more about the bible and could deliver a sermon like my grandfather (no bible college or seminary). I still feel that way today. However, he told me that he learns something new about the bible every time he hears me preach. I know that comment comes from the things I’ve learned from PhDs like you, seminarians, and bible college students that I have encountered in my early walk in ministry of the Word. I’m like Timothy and you all are my Paul. God bless, Bro Rob Day The flip side of this my brot…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-16:916966:Comment:9352462009-08-16T23:59:56.066ZMark H. Stevens, Th.Dhttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/Mark28
The flip side of this my brother is men and women being ordained because they can "whoop" and have little or no Bible knowlege, or because thier father is the pastor.
The flip side of this my brother is men and women being ordained because they can "whoop" and have little or no Bible knowlege, or because thier father is the pastor. While I fully support the nee…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-16:916966:Comment:9352402009-08-16T23:56:15.145ZDr. Michael A. Buttshttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/MICHAEL653
While I fully support the need for Bible trained pastors and leaders, I do not subscribe to the fact that you need to be a part of a seminary to be ordained of God. Having the Bible knowledge, and the indepth study of the Word will enhance any ministry hands down, but we are talking about ordination here. Ordination to the minister is what accreditation is to a school, it give you the right to participate in the sacrements of the Church and to perform certain ceremonies from a legal standpoint.…
While I fully support the need for Bible trained pastors and leaders, I do not subscribe to the fact that you need to be a part of a seminary to be ordained of God. Having the Bible knowledge, and the indepth study of the Word will enhance any ministry hands down, but we are talking about ordination here. Ordination to the minister is what accreditation is to a school, it give you the right to participate in the sacrements of the Church and to perform certain ceremonies from a legal standpoint. Having Bible knowledge again helps this, but remember the Bible says the letter kills, but it is the Spirit that gives life, We must learn to rely on the Spirit, and then use the Biblical knowledge taught to us to enhance what the Holy Spirit emparts to us. Amen Bro. Day, I fully realiz…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-16:916966:Comment:9345352009-08-16T01:12:25.060ZMark H. Stevens, Th.Dhttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/Mark28
Amen Bro. Day, I fully realize that Seminary may not be for everyone BUT every minister of the Gospel should seek more intense training than a layman. would you go to a doctor that didn't study medicine? I don't think so.
Amen Bro. Day, I fully realize that Seminary may not be for everyone BUT every minister of the Gospel should seek more intense training than a layman. would you go to a doctor that didn't study medicine? I don't think so. I truly think that seminary o…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-16:916966:Comment:9345122009-08-16T00:44:12.466ZRobert A. Day, Sr.https://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/RobertADaySr
I truly think that seminary or bible college attendance “could be good” for one’s personal development, whether we are talking about it as a requirement (or not) for ordination. I do look at it as a plus to further myself in understanding of the bible, so that I can be even more effective for God.<br />
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However, this conversation reminds me of the story of Jesus in the midst of the doctors of the law at the temple when He was only 12-years old. He wasn’t as a normal 12-year old playing with other…
I truly think that seminary or bible college attendance “could be good” for one’s personal development, whether we are talking about it as a requirement (or not) for ordination. I do look at it as a plus to further myself in understanding of the bible, so that I can be even more effective for God.<br />
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However, this conversation reminds me of the story of Jesus in the midst of the doctors of the law at the temple when He was only 12-years old. He wasn’t as a normal 12-year old playing with other children as they visited Jerusalem for Passover. And, being a Spirit-filled believer, we wouldn’t be as a normal student attending a bible college or seminary. There will be others who attend because of the historical knowledge they seek after or even instructors there who don’t know the Lord personally. So, we will have the chance to do as Jesus did when He gave them a glimpse of His divinely inspired answers and astonished the “experts” of the law, as a 12-year old. What I’m saying is that Jesus was about His Father’s business and we need to be the same way.<br />
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I think it would be great for all ministers to be in the midst of the supposed “teachers” of the law and have the opportunity to dialogue with them as Jesus did at the temple. You see, Mary and Joseph knew from the dream of Joseph and Angel of the Lord appearing to Mary of Jesus’ Kingly appointment, but didn’t know of His Prophetic or Priestly appointment. He showed them a glimpse of this during His temple visit, when they hastily returned in a worried fashion to pick him up at the place He must have felt very comfortable in visiting because of the conversations going on there. (And, church folk sometimes get worried about the requirement for further education.) But, even though Jesus knew more than all of them, by the Spirit within, He humbled Himself and didn’t reveal everything to the experts and went home with His family as He should have at that time in His life as a little young man. Jesus would later have the opportunity to do the ministry He came to earth for at the age of 30-years old. We also have the opportunity to do ministry before bible college or seminary and afterwards too.<br />
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Even though the bible doesn’t say so, I can bet Jesus was talked about and sought after at many Passovers after that one. (Who knows, maybe there were many opportunities to have many more conversations with the theologians annually.) Basically, what I’m saying is that Jesus increased in wisdom and stature and found favor with God and man. (Luke 2:52) I think bible college and seminary attendance would not only better equip an individual, but will allow one to find favor with both God and man too, just as Jesus did. When we do attend, we shouldn’t be so Spirit-filled that we don’t receive the opportunity to learn things like history and geography that will open up our interpretation of the scriptures even more. Yes, we have the Spirit, but furtherance of educational opportunities can be a good thing too.<br />
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To paraphrase, Matthew Henry says it this way, “In the perfections of Jesus’ divine nature there could be no increase, but of His human nature, His body increased in stature and bulk, He grew in the growing age, and His soul increased in wisdom and all the endowments of a human soul. Though the Eternal Word was united to His human soul from His conception, yet the divinity with Him manifested itself to His humanity by degrees, ad modum recipientis – in proportion to His capacity; as the faculties of His human soul grew more and more capable, the gifts it received from the divine nature were more and more communicated through reading, studying, and dialogue of the Word year after year after year. And, Jesus increased in favor with God and man, that is, in all those graces that rendered Him acceptable to God and man. Herein, Christ accommodated Himself to His estate of humiliation, that as He condescended to be an infant, a child, a youth, so the image of God shone brighter in Him when He grew up to be a youth (12-years old), than it did or could, while He was an infant or a child.”<br />
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The same goes for us! When we start off as babes in Christ, we are on spiritual milk, and then as we mature in Christ we can eat the meat of the Word. This comes through studying to show ourselves approved unto God. (2 Timothy 2:15) The unique thing is that when we study to be approved unto God and not man, we simultaneously are approved by men in the ministry. As the saying goes, God anoints and man appoints. This is where certification, licensure, and ordination come into play. Yes, we have that inner calling that we know to be anointed and doing the work of the Lord, but that outer calling is made evident by people in ordination and appointing us as ministers. The people (or congregation) accepts the Word from us and entrusts their very lives on the balance of what we say to them as answers to their questions. That’s why we must study.<br />
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A seminary graduate once told me something so profound. He said that doctors truly begin their “practice” after they have attained the necessary preparation. That made me think of us beginning to minister at a different level after ordination. (Acts 6:1-7 shows the appointing of deacons for the daily administration, so that another level of ministry can be done, along with constant prayer.) That shows that we’ve put in the work to do what we’re doing in our “profession” and our “calling.” For example, when you’re an ambassador for a country, you’ve served in all kinds of positions of office and met the necessary requirements before you were appointed to go out to represent that country. We should have the same mindset with God. Just look at Paul, he was an example of someone highly qualified; although the argument would be that everyone in the bible wasn’t like Paul. (I know some will play devil’s advocate to make a point or keep the debate going.)<br />
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But, the bottom line is this for me: Bible college or seminary attendance as a requirement for ordination; I would hope so, but I know that will never happen across the board for everyone. However, if one would have the opportunity to attend, I would suggest doing so. God willing, I will in the future!<br />
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God Blessings,<br />
Minister Robert A. Day, Sr. I always go to the word of Go…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-15:916966:Comment:9330422009-08-15T02:48:32.523ZPastor Herman L, Barlow Srhttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/MinHermanLBarlowSr
I always go to the word of God and not what man thinks. If you need wisdom, talk to God: "For the Lord gives wisdom; from His mouth come knowledge and understanding" (Proverbs 2:6 NKJV). "If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally… and it will be given to him" (James 1:5 NKJV). "The wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy" (James 3:17 NKJV). "I will…
I always go to the word of God and not what man thinks. If you need wisdom, talk to God: "For the Lord gives wisdom; from His mouth come knowledge and understanding" (Proverbs 2:6 NKJV). "If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally… and it will be given to him" (James 1:5 NKJV). "The wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy" (James 3:17 NKJV). "I will instruct you and teach you in the way you should go; I will guide you… " (Psalm 32:8 NKJV). Once again I think going to school is a plus but the Word says God will instruct me. I am in the same dilemma brot…tag:abcpreachers.ning.com,2009-08-14:916966:Comment:9324282009-08-14T16:43:15.456ZMark H. Stevens, Th.Dhttps://abcpreachers.ning.com/profile/Mark28
I am in the same dilemma brother, I started late with education. Igot my BA in Theology at 40 and my MA in Ministry at 44, I started preaching at 21, I look back and wish to God I started school sooner, so many things I taught early on out of ignorance and church tradition, A sound Bible school will teach you to study the Bible inductivley (Meaning to draw the Bibles conclusion and not man's)
I am in the same dilemma brother, I started late with education. Igot my BA in Theology at 40 and my MA in Ministry at 44, I started preaching at 21, I look back and wish to God I started school sooner, so many things I taught early on out of ignorance and church tradition, A sound Bible school will teach you to study the Bible inductivley (Meaning to draw the Bibles conclusion and not man's)