Another reason why we are to continue to Break the Silence. Violence comes to us all, let us keep BeBe Winans in prayer as well as his exwife and family. This is another avenue the enemy would love to use against the church. Not condoning his behavior at all. But the violence has to stop, you don't have to demonstrate your love for me by hitting me. Abuse is never to be tolerated by anyone. Jesus died for those hits long time ago. He took the beating so you don't have to. If you have someone in your life hitting or hurting you, be it spouse, child, or significant other. I am once again sounding the alarm: YOU DON'T HAVE TO TAKE THAT! Let's stand together against domestic violence. If the people of God don't stand for what's right, we will always fall for what's wrong.

Court filing: "Irate" singer BeBe Winans pushed ex-wife to ground
MARCH 12--Gospel singer BeBe Winans was booked yesterday on a domestic assault rap for allegedly pushing his ex-wife to the ground during an argument last month. According to a court filing, a copy of which you'll find below, Winans, 46, and his former spouse got into a "verbal altercation" on February 13 about "custody issues dealing with their children." At the time, Winans was at his ex-wife Debra's Nashville home, where he had driven to pick up his children. "The victim was telling the defendant of issues with the children when he became irate. The defendant then pushed the victim to the ground." Winans, pictured in the mug shot at right, was arrested yesterday on a misdemeanor domestic assault charge. He was briefly held at the Davidson County jail before posting $1000 bond. Winans, best known for albums recorded with his sister CeCe, has won four Grammy awards.

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Til' death do us part............at least that's what was in our vows.
My vows said the same thing. However, it also told me to love, honor and cherish her. To take it a step further, the bible says that the husband is to love his wife as Christ loved the church and gave himself for it. Men, loving our wives, does not constitute beating them. Therefore, it is my belief (until someone can show me biblically) that a woman should not stay in an abusive relationship
Minister please, many men as well as women who are in a long term marriage go through all types of issues, trials and tribulations. Your Lord and Saviour that you openly serve was the most abused spouse that ever lived this earth. He came as the despised suffering savior who wasn't "happy" or had an emotional feeling of gladness about being beaten, scourged, shamed, punched, mocked and ultimately walked with a 120 pound cross on his already weaked and blood spattered back while walking over 2 miles to His bloody death because He was happy. He did it because He was....COMMITTED!

And I'm committed to my vows regardless of what we are going through at the moment or whatever this world throws at us. And there are many situations that my parents who have just celebrated their 50th wedding anniversary endured. They endured adultery, drunkenness, emotional abuse, physical abuse, verbal abuse, sickness, cancer, deaths of relatives, racism, riches and poverty, loss of jobs, insults, family dysfunction by relatives a mother-in-law (my grandmother) who tried to create many divisions and attacks to my parents covenant. So many things that I have witnessed first hand in their marriage that today in the world of listening and obeying to the Gospel of Oprah would have been divorced many years ago.

If my parents got divorced based what most would define as "abuse" in this Black Preaching Network forum of Christians would have agreed that they should in fact should divorce, break their vows and live apart and apart from me their son who would've been crushed and not known the redemptive quality of Christ that is working now at this very hour to bring my parents to that oneness that was spoken of at their wedding ceremony over 50 years ago. I thank God for keeping my parents together and they weren't even saved during this time. And based on that experience it has helped me and shaped me in knowing that marriage and my vows are sacred. Yes, sometimes I don't like my wife ,and sometimes she despises me based on some things that are said and done. Marriages go through seasons. And God hates divorce.

My brother some months ago said, "Scott I'm leaving my wife for another woman". His 30yr ago high school sweetheart was now back in his life. His first love. The woman as he said, "should've married". He said he and his wife, Crystal are no longer in love. Yes a feeling of love. He said, "I don't love her no more" and "I have to re-assess my "own" happiness". In other words, his happiness is all that matters. But what about the happiness of his wife and his 12yr old son who loves and adores him? Oh that's right, who cares about those little "insignificant" things called...CHILDREN! And his reasoning or justification that he used was, (yes you guessed it) he said, "well mom and dad should've divorced each other years ago and they have never been happy in their marriage and I don't want to be like that, I'm almost 50 yrs old and I need to be HAPPY.." Well after I said what I needed to say concerning the difference between a CONTRACT and a COVENANT he got off the phone quickly when I opened up God's Word concerning what a covenant entails.

You name me a marriage that has endured over a 40 to 50 and more years and interview them and if they were transparent would tell you all that they endured and suffered through to get to where they are today. In order to get to the resurrection, you will have to go through the cross. So DENY SELF, PICK UP YOUR CROSS and FOLLOW HIM, your suffering Christ. Aren't you glad He suffered and loved you first before you could even love Him?

Scott
Man of God. I can appreciate your dedication and commitment to your wife. She should count her blessings every day for having a husband like you.
However, I have one question for you. DO YOU HAVE DAUGHTERS? I DO! In fact, I havae five. (Take a look at the family pictures on my profile) I'm blessed to to have beautiful girls. They don't see me mistreating my wife, and I'll be doggone if I sit back and watch a man beat my child (when I didn't beat them). Lets be transparent. I'm saved, but if a man ever puts his hands on one of my daughters, my ministry will immediately change to prison ministry, because I'm going to jail. You can't compare the beating that Jesus endured to a man abusing his wife. Yes, I know Jesus took a horrible beating, but Jesus took to beatings so we wouldn't have too. He took the beating to give us a chance to have salvation. My daughter, and no one else's daughter taking a beating is gonna save the world.
Women God does hate divorce just as well as He hates sin period. However, use the good sense that God gave you and get out of these abusive relationships. Too many of them end in death one way or another. I'm sure you'll agree that God also hates murder huh?
Min. Lonnie

Yes I have a daughter (look at my profile) who is only 4yrs old. I also have a wife, mother, sister, female cousins and many aunts as well as wonderful female friends and neighbors whom I adore and treat like the rubies of God that they are.

Gen 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

Usually a woman chooses the man she ultimately winds up with is a direct reflection of what she has witnessed how her father treated her mother to know what is acceptable behavior or not. Have you noticed that in that verse above, never does it say for the woman to leave her father to cleave unto her husband in that scenario. Why? When I ultimately walk my daughter down the aisle to her new husband, I'm giving up my rights to her as her primary father to another father. A woman should never feel as if she's unprotected from her father. There is an exchange going on. I'm not just my wife's husband, but her spiritual father, who represents as the living example of the Holy Father. Kind of hard to do that if I'm absent from her. And really difficult for her to choose a good husband if she see's her father is being from the "whoop-a-hoe tribe". So she should never feel disconnected by a earthly father as well as from the Holy Father. So based on who I am in her life would most likely she would wind up with. I speak to many young ladies in the prison system where I volunteer and the main reason they are there is because of whom they chose in the men in their lives. Because most of these young girls have no idea what a man looks like based on her own father who had abandoned her long ago.

I have never been hit before as a child by my parents, so I don't have a reflective physical response to hit my children. My wife however has been hit and disciplined by her single mother and had to be taught by me that hitting is not effective but can lead to more destructive behavior down to the ages of the generations. Studies have shown that the African American disciplines their children by spanking and hitting more than any other ethnic group in America. Mainly it was due to slavery in that we had to force our children out of fear from massa's whip or face having our unruly children being removed from one plantation to another one without possibly ever seeing them again. And that mndset is still with us today, with dangling crosses around our proverbial necks. Thought whom the son sets free is free indeed?

Now your next point which to me is quite telling, since we now have moved to a more seeker friendly Gospel of feeding the belly of pleasures in this health, wealth and happiness Gospel of lukewarmness. Are you making the erroneous point that we are not to be used to sacrifice self and even to suffer when we come to the cross? Lets walk through the power of the scriptures to see if that indeed is true.

Act 5:41 They therefore departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing that they were counted worthy to suffer dishonor for the Name.

Rom 8:17 and if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified with him.

2Co 1:6 But whether we are afflicted, it is for your comfort and salvation; or whether we are comforted, it is for your comfort, which worketh in the patient enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer:

Php 1:29 because to you it hath been granted in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer in his behalf:

1Th 3:4 For verily, when we were with you, we told you beforehand that we are to suffer affliction; even as it came to pass, and ye know.

2Th 1:5 which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God; to the end that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:

2Ti 1:8 Be not ashamed therefore of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but suffer hardship with the gospel according to the power of God;

2Ti 2:3 Suffer hardship with me, as a good soldier of Christ Jesus.

2Ti 4:5 But be thou sober in all things, suffer hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfil thy ministry.

1Pe 2:20 For what glory is it, if, when ye sin, and are buffeted for it, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye shall take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.

1Pe 3:14 But even if ye should suffer for righteousness' sake, blessed are ye: and fear not their fear, neither be troubled;

1Pe 4:19 Wherefore let them also that suffer according to the will of God commit their souls in well-doing unto a faithful Creator.

AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST

2Ti 3:12 Yea, and all that would live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

Now I knew I had the wrong Bible, knew I shouldn't have bought this bible from those folx who live on bubble street.

And don't forget that one of the fruit of the spirit is...LONGSUFFERING!!

You show me in your Bible where it says when we accept Jesus the Christ, the suffering Christ we are to eat, drink and be merry and to live in happily ever after on a earth where the prince of this world seeks to steal, kill and to destroy us like a roaring lion who seeks only to slaughter.

God Bless

In His Grip

Scott
(Smiling) My brotha,
You seem to dwell on suffering. I know what the word says about it. We have to suffer enough with the things of the world ie...our jobs, finances, sickness, being lied on etc; without havint to suffer at the hands of someone who claims to love us. I"m sorry my brotha, you can't beat me and convince me all at the same time that you love me. I didn't say I would stop loving you, cause God loves us all, despite what we do or don't do.
So I think we have come to a point where you don't agree with me and I don't agree with you. That's called "Agree to Disagree." For all you reader out there, that doesn't mean Brother Scott and I don't love one another. It just means we have difference of opinions.
Listen, Brother Scott, I pray that the Lord continues to bless you and your family
(smiling back) My Brutha'....:)

No, not at all am I belaboring the point about suffering, its appointed to us. It rains on the just and the unjust. Tell you what, read a post I wrote not too long ago concerning this very topic of abuse (suffering) for Christ's sake and please let me know if this isn't the Gospel of Christ:
_______________________________________________________________________

Luk 9:22 "The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and the third day be raised up".

If you walk with Him, if you walk with Christ, the SUFFERING Christ we all will suffer. We must remember that in sharing the Gospel with the power of God we will suffer as our Lord suffered. It is through the suffering of our bodies that Christ is glorified. It is only through the suffering of God's son that those disciples who saw his suffering that the world will see the supreme glory of Christ-- is only when we break free of the Disney world of American comfort and the deception of the prosperity gospel of health, wealth and happiness will we begin to see the true Kingdom of God manifest itself in the nations of the gentiles.

Rom 8:17 "and if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified with him"

How did over 1.4 billion people in the world become believers of Christ Jesus? I'll tell you how, through the 12 Apostles who SUFFERED. That's how. In no way EVER has the Gospel of Christ been delivered powerfully in any way that has pierced the hearts of those who wait in darkness and are found to be hopeless in receiving the Good News of the free gift of salvation through prosperity. If so, they won't worship the Christ, they will worship prosperity. Having a mansion and a bmw is not what brings sinners with a contrite and brokenheart to the throne of grace, but is only through the suffering that is found in us who are called to not only deny self, but to pick up our cross (sign of suffering) and follow Him, a SUFFERING Christ.

Isa 53:5 "But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities; the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed".

Notice in that powerful verse in which Jesus was wounded and bruised and the chastisement of our PEACE was upon Him to SUFFER for us, to be made into a sinner for us, to be made into a spectacle, to be shamed for all to see His nakedness on that cross and to suffer greatly, as He loved us more than we could ever know to demonstrate his loving kindness by sacrificing Himself, through His suffering so that we might know Him to spend eternity with Him. That is the price He paid for us as the suffering Christ. We serve a man who was condemned to death row, a convicted man that this world despised. How can we as the sons of God expect anything else? How can we not rejoice as Paul joyfully accepted his role to suffer and to rejoice over the afflictions of the righteous. Suffering is a gift. A reward for partaking in the sufferings of our Christ. Why do we constantly try to get out of suffering, which brings many who see and are witnesses of our suffering to be also included in eternity through our sacrificial bodies that suffer! Remember one of the gifts of the spirit is longsuffering.

Php 1:29 "because to you it hath been granted in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer in his behalf:"

Will you join in the Son in displaying the greatness in the glory of His grace, supremely in the suffering of His Son? Because there is no other way the world is going to see the glory of Christ until we start living the lifestyle of missionary sacrifice that looks to the world that the treasure in heaven and not of the earth, its the only way. Of course I'll have a Jesus that gives us a car, I'll have the Jesus if the "Pay off is right".. WRONG! You are not going to win the lost unless through the suffering Christ!

Isn't it the "good life", isn't Christianity the "good life"??? Even if its a delusion, so what its the "good life"...WRONG!

Oh, how wrong have we got it in America. Its really hard to be a Christian in America.

I make so many choices to magnify Jesus in hard places, it hurts me everyday, I would not choose this if it weren't true!

Christ died for millions of people all over the world, their debt has been paid, but they do not know it. They can't taste it, they can't feel it, they can't sing that song, "I thank you for the cross"!! There is something missing in the suffering, its not showing up. Its not showing up in 639 people groups in the world of the unevangelized. The presentation of the suffering is not there. There never had been a breakthrough into an unreached people and place without suffering. Mark it down, if your a missionary trust me, you will Suffer. Yes, you will suffer in your marriage, in your health, in your finances, in this world you will suffer if you follow Christ. Don't think it strange when it comes, He paid the price of our salvation, we join Him in that suffering to display the nature of it, how are they going to see how satisfying He is in us, if we look like its the benz that is really satisfying?

2Ti 3:12 "Yea, and all that would live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution."

Brethren, its the only way that those who are dead in their sins will see Jesus the Suffering Christ in us when we suffer with and through Him, to bring those who labor and heavy laden with sin, to bring them rest in the Living Christ.

God only had one son and He made that son a missionary, and although He was rich, He became poor so that we can become rich.

Now I ask is the slave greater than the master?

May God bless us all

In His Grip

Scott


P.S. as of February since I wrote this blog, only two folx responded. I'm surprised even at that small number that did.....LOL
Prophetess Moore,
This is a great topic because not only are women and men being abused physically, but also mentally and financially in the name of God. It is very unfortunate, but I can relate to being abused as a women of God. I personally know it is not the will of God that anyone should be beatin, slapped , cursed out, financially broken, raped, molested, killed, stabbed, murdered, or taken advantaged using the name of God. The Bible say, " resist the devil and he will flee" and "to put on the full armour of God that we may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil",and "after we done all stand".

One of the greatest mistake many Christian people make is thinking they can change the other person. Christians can only change him/herself into the image of God after obeying and living according to the word. Secondly, everyone claiming to be a man/women of God is not. Thirdly, many people are marrying for money, name recognition. Instead of knowing there is only one name on earth whereby, one will be saved. His name is Jesus. Finally, many are unequally yoked because their biological clock was ticking and they needed to assist God with finding a mate. Light and darkness will never mix in the kingdom. It does not matter how much you pray, speak in tongues, jump up and down, roll across the church or what position you hold in the church. How can two walk together accept they agree.
How many marriages are in total agreement with everything and anything. We take so many things out of its proper context while the divorce rate within the Christian community is equaled to this fallen world. Thought we were the light and salt of the earth? What are we preserving? Thought we were to lead sacrificial lives? Thought we were commanded to be living sacrifices? Oh yeah forgot in this new church dogma we don't preach on sacrifice and suffering as once did, now its the "health, wealth and happiness" doctrine. So if your being "abused" which is never really defined or lightly defined as "emotional" or "verbal" rarely physical and rarely to the death. Lets not take an exception and make it a rule. Have you known anyone pastor anyone who has been changed and renewed and transformed by the cleansing of God's Word? Have you ever known anyone who was once lost and now is found pastor? What a shame cause I know many.
And we wonder why our children and young people laugh at the idea of marriage. No why, cause they have witnessed only failed ones. They never got to see the power of God's Word working from going from two to ONE. I guess if it doesn't happen in our time frame, not God's lets just give up forsake our vows, not be faithful, leave and cleave to someone else and teach our children, what? So I guess when we do leave our vows and covenant we now will be celibate for the rest of our lives, since the Bible is clear from the lips of our Saviour that if one divorces and the spouse is still alive and you re-marry you will be in...ADULTERY.

What say you?
Hello to all respondents, it appears a nerve has been touched based on the responses posted, it is clear, that God died for our sins as well as took the beating for us, EVERYTHING He did, He did for us, He stood in our place, yes you can be abused, mentally and emotionally, because the abuser is so wise and cunning one has just enough sense not to hit you, hence to leave evidence of their behavior, ie. bruises, black eyes, broken bones. Mr. Newman, not everyone is fortunate to have had success in marriage as you, and yes it does say whoever marries one that is divorced and the spouse is allive commits adultery, however, sir, He said that my grace is sufficient, if that be the case there would be no one in the church, given the high ratio of divorce within the body, Having said that, if a person who continues to lie, cheat, steal, manipulate or whatever, eat too much then if it is wrong or sinful, are they considered a lost soul, having missed the mark, or is the grace of God sufficient? that is why it is called Amazing Grace. What it will take is for men like you loving your wife, teaching other men, in the spirit of love, by word and demonstration how to love as Christ loved the church. We live in a society, where many man, wants as many women as he can have (riding on the grace and mercies of God) unfaithful, uncommitted, unthankful, unholy, IN the church. These people, the Winans were already divorced, whatever the reason is not my business, it just didn't work out. I am sure you have said something somewhere in the course of your marriage to make your wife cry, many people don't have the stickitto ness to endure, I can guarantee you this, not one person I know on this panel walked into their marriage with the intention of one day walking out or being left for someone else. It's called life, but you don't have to get so angry as a Man of God, worldwide fame to the point you are hauled off to jail. His was broadcasted nationwide as others, as a tactic from the enemy to laugh at the church simply because of his status in "church society" imagine please the number of women in the body of Christ, being abused on a daily/weekly basis, saying nothing, doing nothing, because of the mentality you have, that we are to take it, the devil is a lie. I am one that will fight back. Abuse is unacceptable, ask Bishop Weeks, better yet ask BeBe Winans, Dr. Pastor Randy White, Tina Turner, Chris Brown, need I say anymore. Ask the many hundreds of thousands of women who is sitting in jail because one day she decided to fight back and ended up taking that person's life, they will tell you it was unacceptable. I pray you have only sons and no daughters, because every woman that has ever been victimized is someone's daughter, sister, mother, aunt...
My Brotha,
I think you're looking over my whole point. I do see yours and agree to some of what you're saying. However, I have people coming to me in confidence all the time telling me my husband is this or my wife is doing that. The first thing I ask them is to tell me about their spouse before they got married. 80% of the time, there was something about the other person that should've raised a red flag. Then they get into these relationship and wonder why he's so controling, or why he beats me etc. Ladies you have got to stop getting involved with these men simply because he looks good or he's fine. Those are the days of old, because some of these good looking men are beating the heck out of ya'll. Look at Chris Brown. He ain't a bad looking dude.
I will never encourage anyone to leave his or her marriage unless it's a matter of life or death, and then, I'm only suggesting seperation. Not divorce. If the victim of domestic abuse can seperate him/herself from the abuse, then with prayer and help maybe the abuser will change. On the other hand, if the victim stays in the abusive marriage, the marriage could possibly end in an untimely death. When you see as many deaths by spouse as I have, then maybe you'll understand why I feel the way I do. I hope you never have to experience someone close to you being shot in the head (as I did) at close range by her gealous spouse.
I'm not encouraging folks to walk out of a marriage because of an arguement. If that be the case, my wife and I would've been divorced.
As far as mental, emotional, sexual abuse is concerned, they are just as bad if not worse than physical. They tear down a persons self esteem.
I encourage anyone who's having marital problems, to in addition to reading the bible and praying, read a book called "Love Dare." You can pick it up at walmart for about $10.

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