The following selected verses are for reference to the topic under discussion.


1Co 12:1  Now, concerning what you wrote about the gifts from the Holy Spirit. I want you to know the truth about them, my friends.
1Co 12:2  You know that while you were still heathen, you were led astray in many ways to the worship of lifeless idols.
1Co 12:3  I want you to know that no one who is led by God's Spirit can say "A curse on Jesus!" and no one can confess "Jesus is Lord," without being guided by the Holy Spirit.
1Co 12:4  There are different kinds of spiritual gifts, but the same Spirit gives them.
1Co 12:5  There are different ways of serving, but the same Lord is served.
1Co 12:6  There are different abilities to perform service, but the same God gives ability to all for their particular service.
1Co 12:7  The Spirit's presence is shown in some way in each person for the good of all.

1Co 12:24  which the more beautiful parts do not need. God himself has put the body together in such a way as to give greater honor to those parts that need it.

1Co 12:25  And so there is no division in the body, but all its different parts have the same concern for one another.

1Co 12:28  In the church God has put all in place: in the first place apostles, in the second place prophets, and in the third place teachers; then those who perform miracles, followed by those who are given the power to heal or to help others or to direct them or to speak in strange tongues.
1Co 12:29  They are not all apostles or prophets or teachers. Not everyone has the power to work miracles
1Co 12:30  or to heal diseases or to speak in strange tongues or to explain what is said.
1Co 12:31  Set your hearts, then, on the more important gifts. Best of all, however, is the following way.


1Co 13:8  Love is eternal. There are inspired messages, but they are temporary; there are gifts of speaking in strange tongues, but they will cease; there is knowledge, but it will pass.
1Co 13:9  For our gifts of knowledge and of inspired messages are only partial;
1Co 13:10  but when what is perfect comes, then what is partial will disappear.

1Co 13:13  Meanwhile these three remain: faith, hope, and love; and the greatest of these is love.

As I look around this site I wonder why all the titles??
The early institutional church saw no need for nameing people or their roles but it seems my people have taken it to the extreme and I wonder why?

Does it add to anyone, or does the person welding the title feel "bigger".  The plethora of prophets and the female corollaries who do not seem to fit the biblical image.  Jesus never called himself a healer he simply prayed for  those in need that his Father would heal them, Jesus the man was not pretentious and self promoting.

I introduce myself to virtually everyone with only my name even when wearing my collar.  That in itself is identification enough.

I am asked are you a priest, preacher, pastor, minister, or what ever is comfortable to the questioner.  And I answer, yes. 
I used to explain what each title meant to my position now I just answer yes and do my best to show out for Jesus.

I will be interested to hear from persons who have assumed the non traditional titles as ways of identifying themselves as to why they did.

How do the titles improve what they do.

God talks to prophets to tell his people to do something or not do something at least that is the role of those in the bible.

God works through healers to pass on healing, to change the physical conditions of those who are touched, prayed for and so on.  These in the gospels are never chance occurrences, Jesus prayed the physical condition changed, right then, on the spot.  It never took a second visit and never for money.

I do not deny gifts of the spirit, I am a teacher, I teach, any thing.
It is a gift not a title, it is a suffix and not a prefix. 

What I have is to add to and draw the body together.
The body is so fractured, separated, and disjointed how do the titles that are worn draw us together?

And the greatest of these is love.


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"It is terribly sad that many of the BPN members (including myself at times), do not appear to know how to graciously and lovingly communicate without undue vicious attacks."

Chaplain, you can squeeze me into that list also!
Beloved, I have enjoyed following this discussion. You are all so lovely and hilarious at the same time. Lovely in attitude and openess, hilarious because you made me laugh and think at the same time. There was growth within the walls of dialogue. Blessings to all of you in unity of the faith. Anita
YOu tell us what is with all of these Titles, since you name is a title.
Mr. REVZ62
What wonderful discussion in here. I both agree and disagree. I guess some might say talking out of both sides of my mouth..lol And I don't want to bring up a point that has already been established. But I read on one of the threads that souls are not really being won. I agree on that matter. I have been around a long time. And it seems we are swamping members from one church to another. I have also learned not to waste to much time figuring out other people's ministry. If you say God called you to be an Apostle-bishop to the 3rd and 4th power. That is between you and God. If people chose to follow you with all those titles and 12 members. (Yes I know it has nothing to do with numbers)That's between them and God. I must put all my energy into doing what God has called me to do. I pastored a church a few years ago and within months we had a decent crowd. Yes people that left there church and some I actually told to go back. Because they left for reasons behind not getting a title. Just started a second ministry that is growing a bit slower. I prayed and asked God to use us to win new souls. I'm not against God sending already saved members at all. New people to the area or whatever reason they are looking for a church. But I am no longer interested in saved people, i know that sound kind of wrong. But i'm not, not on that level. God has called us to win souls that are on their way to hell. I am not going to preach against the Apostle-bishop nor talk about him. I have my personal beliefs that have originated from careful study of scripture and research into Church History. But i refuse to be the preacher that causes the church to seperate any further than it is right now. I will always preach against sin. I will not judge. Hey and for about 20 bucks you can go on the internet and get any title you want signed sealed and delivered. They will probably make one up for you. The most holy honorable Aposhipvangel. I'm joking. God Bless you all. And it is my sincere prayer that your ministries are blessed and doing Kingdom Work to the glory of God.
You said:

"I must put all my energy into doing what God has called me to do. I pastored a church a few years ago and within months we had a decent crowd. Yes people that left there church and some I actually told to go back. Because they left for reasons behind not getting a title. Just started a second ministry that is growing a bit slower. I prayed and asked God to use us to win new souls. I'm not against God sending already saved members at all. New people to the area or whatever reason they are looking for a church. But I am no longer interested in saved people, i know that sound kind of wrong. But i'm not, not on that level."

Thats "Apostolic-talk"! Such is the focus of Kingdom-minded Apostolic leaders. You may not be an Apostle, and you may or may not be for Apostles in this day and age, but you sure are talking the Apostolic talk, and walking the Apostolic walk.
I introduce myself to virtually everyone with only my name even when wearing my collar. That in itself is identification enough.

May I ask why are you using RevZ62 on this site? Just curious as it seems to contradict your statement above.

Shalom in Yeshua
I agree.
Interestingly enough, its the one's that come on with the title that are arguing about titles, especially with non-Biblical titles such as Reverend! Go figure......

Not to be boastful, but that statement of yours, RevZ62, moreso applies to me than to you. I'm on here with a Ministry uniform, but no title up, even though I hold a title. To find mine out, I will either have to tell you, you will have to read my profile, or simply ask. So like Chaplain asked before, why are you using RevZ62 on this site as it seems to contradict your statement above?
I didn't mean it to sound like an attack, but come on! Lets be real, the titles are necessary when used properly. If you want a lawyer, you wont call your plumber; if you want the dog, you wont ask for the cat; if you want Sue, you wont ask for Jack.

Likewise, if I want a Prophet I will ask for just that, A PROPHET:

2nd Kings 3:11 "But Jehoshaphat said, Is there not here a Prophet of the LORD, that we may enquire of the LORD by him? And one of the king of Israel's servants answered and said, Here is Elisha the son of Shaphat, which poured water on the hands of Elijah."

or an APOSTLE:

1st Corinthians 9:1 "Am I am not an Apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?"

or a BISHOP:

Acts 20:28 "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you Overseers (Bishops), to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood."

If any person will dispute their usefulness, I will be ready to point out a few things concerning that person:

-they are not called to that particular official title that they are speaking against, therefore they lack understanding.
-they are young in their calling, and therefore are speaking out of misguided zeal
-they are hypocrites, possessing titles themselves that they aren't so ready to relinquish
-they are rebellious, possessing titles, yet feeling threatened at the idea of someone potentially "outranking" their position (example: Bishops against Apostles due to the idea that they are the top member of the Church)
-they are running from the Ministry calling
-they are indoctrinated negative comments against a certain title/office

The first, second, and last one are the only ones that can gain sympathy. The people that fall into the rest of those categories ought to be ashamed of themselves. I do believe that there are those who are falsely claiming titles in order to sit with the up-echelon, but don't be careful as to how to handle the rest who are genuine.


Acts 5:33-39 "When they heard that, they were cut to the heart, and took counsel to slay them. Then stood there up one in the council, a Pharisee, named Gamaliel, a doctor of the law, had in reputation among all the people, and commanded to put the apostles forth a little space; and said unto them, Ye men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what ye intend to do as touching these men. For before these days rose up Theudas, boasting himself to be somebody; to whom a number of men, about four hundred, joined themselves: who was slain; and all, as many as obeyed him, were scattered, and brought to nought. After this man rose up Judas of Galilee in the days of the taxing, and drew away much people after him: he also perished; and all, even as many as obeyed him, were dispersed. And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought: but if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God."
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