Tithing In the New Testament

[Pastor Arlee Turner Jr.]

I was doing some research on tithing, earlier today, and came across some very interesting observations. If anyone wishes to comment on these, let the sparks start flying:

Abraham and Jacob gave a tenth of what they had - once. It was not a repeated deal. The Tithe has specific rules and is reserved for specific purposes, none of which can be obeyed in the church since none of the circumstances exist. If you choose to give 10 percent in faith, in response to what God has done in your life, that’s fine. But the instant you make it a demand and a requirement, you have passed from grace to law. If you want to give 30 percent or your income, that’s fine. But the instant you make it a demand and a requirement, you have passed from grace into law. And the two simply do not mix.

A church might not get “enough” money if they don’t require tithing? Hey, maybe that church shouldn’t exist. Or perhaps the pastor should be willing to - oh, I don’t know - GET A JOB like paul, to support himself. You don’t have a building? Rent a hall, as small a hall as the offerings will support. And if they are enough to support one at all, then maybe the group SHOULD cease to exist.

Most folks who push tithes generally promote the ideas that a church has to have a building, the pastor has to be full time, and they (the church) has to have a lot of money to do things in the neighborhood as a church organization. I suspect you would be hard pressed to show me any of these ideas in the New Testament. Sure an ox should be fed, but it doesn’t say he has to be fed vintage hay.

The tithe comes in the form of pressure…..

Prior to accepting the offering….”All the tithers please stand”…..

Now how is a novice to articulate what is occuring before them when the are sitting and those whom are giving are commended to stand?

So this is not some store front-church type of pressure tactic.

The pressure comes when the pracher reaches series’ on the tithe, preaching “first-fruits” or God won’t bless you….you will be cursed with a curse……

Pressure comes in the form of churches NOT assiting individuals monetarily unless they access their financials and tithe records prior to considering such……

Pressure comes in the form of conforming to the church “vision” or agenda…..or be left behind and chastised among your leaders/peers accordingly (to their interpretation of the Word)……

Now for the last time, the Bible instructs us to give to support the ministry. I’m not sure how many times that have been mentioned. And yes, if a person has the MEANS to give, but doesn’t, then they are acting in rebellion against God. But please lets not limit this to not tithing or giving to the church. What about the poor? What about folk that are less fortunate than yourself that are outside of the church building? Doesn’t that hold some relevance?

Pastor Arlee Turner Jr.

[Toni]

Pastor Arlee,

" If you choose to give 10 percent in faith, in response to what God has done in your life, that’s fine. But the instant you make it a demand and a requirement, you have passed from grace to law. If you want to give 30 percent or your income, that’s fine. But the instant you make it a demand and a requirement, you have passed from grace into law. And the two simply do not mix."

I'm in agreement with your comment. Its wrong to pressure people into giving so that you yourself can get fat! I cannot tell you the discussions and agreements to disagree I've engaged in with minister friends on this. Teach people how to discern the Holy Spirit for themselves. Yeah, I know they wont rely on you so much anymore, but, uh, isnt that the point to see men grow up in Christ? When men grow up in Christ HIS SPIRIT will direct them in all things, including how much to toss into the offering bucket. In my experience EVERY TIME God has spoken to me to give something it always but always exceeded what any tithe would have been. Most times God is silent on what to give, because he is not directing you to give. He knows how some will pump the people up with enticing words to feed mens' greed and flesh. There is little to no return on seed when God has not directed it to be sown in the first place. The people end up dissappointed, and hurt in God because leadership overly taxes them, while leaders shear wool off without mercy until the sheep bleed. It reminds me so much of what was happening in Nehemiah 5.

And, whoever started that thing about more than one offering during the same service should be whipped.

[A.W. Bowman]

Amen, sister -

The usual response to a non-tither is:

They don't tithe, they won't give either, and without the paying of tithes (tribute, bribe, dues), they will not minister within the congregation either.

Anything wrong with that kind of mindset?

[Pastor Arlee Turner Jr.]

Where in the New Testament does it say that you need to have a physical building to worship, Mr. Watson?

Acts 3:44: "And all that believed were together, and had all things common. And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men as every man had need. And they continued daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from HOUSE TO HOUSE...."

Acts 5:42: "And daily in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ."

Let me repeat what I said in the statement that started this discussion in the first place:

"A church might not get “enough” money if they don’t require tithing? Hey, maybe that church shouldn’t exist. Or perhaps the pastor should be willing to - oh, I don’t know - GET A JOB like paul, to support himself. You don’t have a building? Rent a hall, as small a hall as the offerings will support. And if they are enough to support one at all, then maybe the group SHOULD cease to exist.

Most folks who push tithes generally promote the ideas that a church has to have a building, the pastor has to be full time, and they (the church) has to have a lot of money to do things in the neighborhood as a church organization. I suspect you would be hard pressed to show me any of these ideas in the New Testament. Sure an ox should be fed, but it doesn’t say he has to be fed vintage hay."

You don’t need a building. And if the family doesn’t want to meet in a building, why should they? None of what the Bible describes as our responsibilities toward one another revolve around the facilities and trappings of church.

[A.W. Bowman]

You made an interesting comparison concerning the church and prostitution. Another lady did the same thing a little earlier.

Please see:

http://hashaliach.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article...

[Toni]

Oh boy. Its a mafia mentality: you pay me (tithes, bribe, dues whatever you want to callit) for the priviledge to do business (or preach or join) on/in my territory (church, club, whatever).

Its a means to control and manipulate which has no place among people of God.

I strongly dislike it when churches say "all tithers stand up" or call them up first to give so everyone can see you. Isnt that against scripture, which says do your alms in secret and your heavenly father will reward you openly? I very rarely fill out an offering envelope. Why? God knows what I give and its really nobodies business. No, not even the govt's. I stick my money in an envelop and seal it, quietly fold the check in half, or, I'll throw a roll of bills into the bucket.

[Joseph Gill]

The definition of alms is "money or other donations given to the poor and needy"; alms are therefore distinct from tithes and offerings given to the church. Of course, you might say that Jesus was teaching a principle that all giving should be anonymous when he said "do not your alms before men, to be seen of them" [Matt. 6:1]. But of course there was another time Jesus sat in the temple with a view of the treasury and watched folks making their offerings [Mark 12:41-44]. He didn't take the opportunity to decry public offerings then, and instead used the openness of the offertory to make a point to his disciples about a poor widow's relative generosity.

There are some other passages in the New Testament that at least imply that public offerings were the norm in the early church. The danger is not in seeing what someone else is giving, it is in drawing conclusions about their generosity (or your own) from what they give.

[Toni]

ok re the definition of alms, thanks Joseph

[Pastor Arlee Turner Jr.]

It gets even worse than that, Toni!

The pressure comes when the preacher preaches a series on the tithe, preaching “first-fruits” or "God won’t bless you"; "….you will be cursed with a curse……"

Pressure comes in the form of churches NOT assiting individuals monetarily unless they access their financials and tithe records prior to considering such……

Pressure comes in the form of conforming to the church “vision” or agenda…..or be left behind and chastised among your leaders/peers accordingly (to their interpretation of the Word)……

If you are being told that “if you don’t tithe, then you are cursed with a curse” or “you will have a hole in your pocket” or “the Lord will not bless you”, then that is coersing someone to give. You are correct, we are supposed to support the ministry, no doubt. But plainly stating it, you don’t have to twist and lie on the Bible to get money from people. If the followers are truely sincere, then they will give. Furthermore, I don’t believe that leadership should be in a position to have the saints be the primary source of income. To me, they should be able to support themselves so that they won’t be tempted to beg for money.

[Evangelist Altha Fugett]

Bro. Watson a church cannot operate without offerings, let me qualify this however with, I do not believe that it is mandatory, and I do not believe that one is cursed if they don't pay tithes.

There are four general types of giving:
1. Cheerful tithe- This follows the paths outlined in the Old Testament Covenant(OTC) to instruct them in their giving while cheerfully and willingly submitting themselves to that authority.

2. Cheerful Spirit-led- This follows the paths outlined in the New Testament Covenant(NTC) to instruct them in their giving and cheerfully and willingly submit themselves to that authority.

3. Un-cheerful tithe- This believes tithing is right, but generally either struggle to or don't give in accordance to the paths of giving outlined in the OTC.

4. Un-cheerful Spirit-led- This believes free-will is right, but generally either struggle to or don't give in accordance to the paths of giving outlined in the New Testament Covenant.


Here is a list to help us lay a foundation for Spirit-led giving and tithing in order to understand the authority of God’s covenants.

1. The New Testament Covenant has a higher authority than the Old Testament covenant.

2. The New Testament will endorse, continue, confirm, modify, or abolish any form of Old Testament law or principle. For example, the New Testament frees us from food regulations declared in the Old Testament Covenant, and confirms our responsibility towards the ministers at the altar.

3. In order for a law in the Word of God to be considered an eternal principle, it must duplicate an exact character trait of God. For instance circumcision is not an eternal law, and cannot even be performed outside of an earthly body; but spiritual circumcision is an attribute of God, and its truth lives eternally.


We ned to be led of the Spirit and allow no man to judge us

[Child of the Kingdom]

Hello Anthony,

You can get the full article from Fugett's reply at the following link.

http://churchtithesandofferings.com/

There is a lot more on their page in the article.

[Toni]

Evangelist,

my spirit bears witness to what you wrote. I like it. I guess I'm NTC giver.

Until God tells me to write out a $300 check and I didnt bring $3G home on my paycheck. LOL So, I sit in my seat and deal with it. The battlefield really is in the mind. I write the check and I'm not unhappy about it. I KNOW that when God tells me to do something like this, He has a reason, and part (never all) of it involves blessing me.

God has dealt with me over the years on this, even at night in dreams. I'm convinced.

[Toni]

ps, Evangelist, can I copy your comments too for this personal study I'm doing. I'd like to have this all in one place, with AW's comments on the ordinance too.