Calling All Preachers

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

All right, let me be straight foward here. No one has an affinity for preaching particualry sermonic celebration then me! Well save maybe Rev. Dr. M.J. Simmons who is currently writting the much anticipated anthology on Black preaching. She is the quenn of Black preaching! With that being said I need to post a serious series of questions:

1.) How can one know when there sermon was effective? I mean really ought we assess our sermonic success via congregational interaction? Is it likeley that people can even really concentrate and commit to memory our life shaping discourse while screaming back "Amen" and "Say it" to us while simultaneously tapping, slapping and touching their neighbor? Moreover, all of us I dare say it have at some point either played church, watched kids play church, or have playfully chit-chatted about church enough to know that we can all feign, fake or play shout. What's to say that congregants don't do the same? Perhaps many are just conditioned to respond to certain organ chords, certain tonal inflections, and perhaps much of the pandemonium praise we elicit through sermon is crowd influenced mob behavior? In short, I am asking my brothers and sisters for a viable means for assessing the sermonic task, by viable I mean a tangible observable means, while I do beleive after doing the deed it ought to "be well with one's soul" in this petition however, I am calling for more than that.

2.)Speaking of celebration and it's effectiveness at eliciting emotive response from a congregation, I feel the need to pose this question: when is enough.....well enough? Do you beleive it is possible to over do it?

3.)Is it a sermon if I do not go to Golgotha and close at the cross? What If I am preaching from the Hebrew Scriptures? Or preaching in the Advent season, must I always hasten to the cross? I admit, I love hearing the passion narrative and I am planning on having 1 Cor. 2:2 inked indeliably on my body, so no one is more cross crazy than yours truly, however, I feel the need to raise this relevant question, is a sermon salvific if it has no mention of the cross. Let me give a bit more insight as to why this issue is a concern for me. In Christ I beleive God reconciled the world to God's self. No doubt, however the atonemnet theory (Jesus' death for our sins) is but one of the many ways of talking about Jesus' redemptive tenure here on earth. Might we as preachers find other salvific means of expressing God's love for us by preaching the full gospel. By full gospel I mean the multitude of ways in which God saves us! I am not dismissing the cross, not even, but what I am doing is pushing for us as preachers to take God and God's gospel out of the box we've cognitively configured to put Him in. I am hoping that we can open our eyes, ears, minds and spirits to the Holy Spirit that He may direct us into a fuller understanding of the significance of Christ's life. I beleive that there is much salvation in the birth, life, death, and Ressurection of Jesus! I am disheartened that we often Jesus' significance to one defining moment in time.

Your comments, questions, considerations are wanted, welcomed, and warrented

[John]

Well Brother West I do agree that one can't deliver God's message without God providing His message to give and too me man's science, astrology and mysticism is just that, MAN's. Too me some of this is like VOODOO as was/is Babylonian Mysteries (where Catholocism comes from). Now I do believe that real astrology has nothing to do with "hey what sign are you and all that hocus pocus." Just as the wise men looking for the baby Jesus read the stars to find Him. But everytime it seems when man takes what is natural and puts his 2 cents into it he turns it into trash. None of those prophets, prophetess, disciples or apostles had the ability to do anything but were led by the Spirit, Who taught and told them what to say and write. Jesus was no ordinary man as some say either (none on this post first of all so don't think this is what I'm saying). Just my feelings about it and we know I'm not the educated one here but I do feel I am being blessed by God in some way because I am so serious about God and knowing Him and He knows this because there was a time when He didn't reveal or send me anywhere to get edcuated in Him. Peace and love my Brother.

[Bishop S. JaNine Hyman, Ph.D.]

Bro. John, there was no reply button to your comment, so I'm doing it here. This thing is JACKED up --I think we blew it up with all this righteous "fightin'" we've been doing. LOL

Ido believe the the prophets or their scribes wrote down what they said. Most of them did not sit down to pen the words as YHWH geve them, but their words were scripted after they had been spoken for the most part. Some of it was written after they were dead. What we have now, is not the same as what was scripted. It has been tainted and contiminated by those who attempted to unify a religion in order to take over the world (namely Europeans, and especially King James of England). aThe way any people is conquered is to replace their God and their religion. That is what has happened to us; this is why every generation needs prophets to itnerpret the mind and will of God, and to find the SPIRIT of the script, just as Jesus did.

Even when people are receiving direct revelation from God, it is filtered through the eyes of their culture, gender, beliefs, world-views, experience, neurological functioning and the like. This is why most of OT prophecy is as cultural as it is spiritual. If you do not extract the historical, gender, and cultural contexts, you will get the letter of what was written, not what God meant. Again, this is why every generation has prophets. God has never stopped doing that--He does not change, nor do His principles change. White folks convinced black folks and poor white folks, and brown folks that the Bible was the final say, so that no one would EVER get a revelation from God which might cause them to revolt --namely this came from Europe also. Why would God write NOTHING for 4,000 years, then only write about ONE mixed multitude of people and ONE religion for 2,000, and then be silent for another 2000? That is ludicrous, but most people have been bamboozled to believe that. God was speaking since the beginning before e're a Bible, Torah, Ngil, Koran was written. The Bible is primarily about ONE group of people's history. What about the rest of the WHOLE world? God had no word for them?

In our human spirits, Bro. John, God has deposited his truth. Yet, western religioun teaches us to suppress our spirits in lieu of what our heads have been taught by others. That is why we really KNOW that these inconsistencies exists in our spirits, but we ignore that gentle nudging of our spirits that makes us ask questions just as Brother Napoleon asks. When we get unorthidoxed answers, we get crucified by the religiously immature people who are afraid to tackle the big issues because their whole belief system (which was given to them by someone else) will come crashing down.

As far as your other question about being related--there WERE other people on the earth during Noah's flood. The people writing were only aware of their OWN African continent at that time, and wrote based on their limited knowledge...that is unless you want to believe that Noah's sons had sex with their sisters and repopulated the earth that way. EWE! lol According to that Shem, Ham, and Japeth stuff....that would also have to be continent specific. If it IS true, then Ham are the dark africans (from which Abreham, Nimrod, etc decended), and Shem are the lighter Africans (the so-called semites--not SHEMITES mind you), and the Japethites which are whites (the decendents of whom Paul preached to--these are called Gentiles in your older KJV of the Bible). Gentiles were not non-jews originally; this was an entitlement relegated to the Japhethites. If we follow the story of Noah, then whites would be decendents of Africans (which is provable by scientific fact)...that would make us all kin. There is one race--human race. However, God has deemed it that we would be different nations, different ethnicities, different cultures etc. This is God's design so obviously it does make a difference to Him, or else He would not have created such diversity. If we all become the

[John]

Thank you as always Bishop Hyman but are you telling me that God didn't inspire men to write what He wanted in order to get the truth from Him and satan didn't put in men what he wanted written to confuse us? Why wouldn't God make the dominating language at the time the language for His Word to be interpreted and then to ensure it was what He wanted, put in the King of England's (no matter what kind of person he really was) heart/mind the allowance of the faithful to interpret into English? Why couldn't God as He did with Moses and others put in their minds/hearts what and how to interpret to cause the English language to mean what He meant and said from day one? There are bibles that were wriiten from Alexandria and Syria and I believe the Syrian text or major text is from God and the minor text from Alexandria from satan. You can clear that up for me please. I know I use to have that feeling that King James being a white man wrote the bible for white people (KJV) until I got a better understanding that in reality he had nothing to do with it. I just don't believe that any author of the bible sat down to write anything but were totally inspired what to write by God because it is from God and you can't get man's message mixed with God's message as we have some bibles in print today that are.

This one please explain! You're saying to me (and I'm trying to interpret the best I can) that during the flood, the flood either didn't wipe out everyone as the bible says so there were either people floating on tree branches or treading water or somehow survived the flood as did Noah and family! You saying to me when the waters receeded there were other people somehow? I do know that in those days people slept with close relatives as did the children of Adam and Eve, who else was there? Help me understand this one please and please understand I in no way am trying to be funny about this or what I say.

And understand this about me, I was as Black as they came in my early life being with the Panther Party knowing brother Bunchy Carter and in meetings with Angela Davis and Geronimo and others in LA. I knew Billy Jackson that was assasinated while in Folsum and Fred Hampton, Huey, Eldrigdg and others. I couldn't stand white period and anyone that knows me from the past will tell you this. But for some reason when God got hold of me all that 'only black' and that separatism attitude in me started changing. I'm not saying that I don't look out for us whose skin is black and of African descent no but I'm shedding that rascist attitude or reaction from being deprived or denied by them. But you help me understand or direct me to the source of your knowledge to see what you are saying or meaning please.

I agree there is but one race and we have become the different colors because of climates and so have different ethnicities, cultures and the likes but I think we have allowed those differences with the help of satan make all that something that's not intended but only by the war between satan and God. I believe what we take as meaning something really has no significance but only to us as humans. This is about a war that's going on in heaven and one day satan and his cronies will see they lost from the beginning. Personally I'm not going to go back into that everyone came from Africans and they (scientist) discovered the oldest remains and it was of African descent and get caught up in all that. I dont' think it means a thing in the realm of things. It only means something to those that have that so called race issues. When its all said and done I don't think there will be any human form as we know it and all these colors and issues.

But you know we as humans can use our intellect to try to explain whatever and it don't matter because in the end He will show us that our intelligence is foolishness to Him and we will be told what we don't know. God bless you Bishop Hyman and I thank you for your posts and knowledge always.

[John]

Sorry Bishop Hyman I want to respond to your saying God has prophets today and He never changes. I agree with those statements but (by now you and Brothers West and Harris know I have buts) I also understand that we have probably more false prophets than real ones. Just as sometimes we can't tell the difference between Christians and non believers today I don't thnk I'd know a prophet if they stood in front of me and please if there are any and if you three are I don't mean to come off to dis you three at all because trust me I do know you three know more and blessed in His Word more than me. I'm just a person that loves God and His Word and want to really understand. I'm tired of being confused by the world. Anyway I know God doesn't change and believe that with all my heart. But when I read Revelations I also realize we are in the last Church Age and it's the worst one of the other six and all these that fess to know him don't and those that use His Name in vain (not talking about cussing) and I do feel using God's name in vain is fessing to know Him and telling other you know Him in sermons and wrong doctrine being taught and using His Word for your own gain is using His Name in vain. And as the bible says they are going to have you know what to pay. So I guess I'm trying to say I couldn't tell a prophet from a non prophet though I will say when I speak with you, Brothers West and Harris could certainly be. See Bishop Hyman I'm not educated in His Word as you, Brothers West and Harris are and I don't put things in writing as eloquently as you three do and wish I could but I have a zest and love for Him I believe no less than you three. I just want to know things and can't help for the baby-nish questions and probably answers. I just feel I keep being led and shown because of my sincereness I have for Him by Him. I get answers from the strangest ways and from individuals as you and Brothers West and Harris. So I know you three may get frustrated with me at times but you're gonna have to put up with it because that's who I am. LOL Bless you.

[Bishop S. JaNine Hyman, Ph.D.]

Brother John, I am saying that the KJV was a political move. If you find an older King James Version, read the preface and the preamble. You would think they are giving praie to God, but the praise is to His Majesty, King James, who ordered that the bible be written in some unified state so that he could possess and control the people of England, France, and other nations. I am saying to you that they deliberately took all the African/Hebraic names of God out--that is why in our Bible, the Lord really has no name--just a title. Why do you think that is? IN addition, it tooke the true name of Jesus out and replaced al lthe apostles' names with White European common names. Why do you think that was? All the images of Yeshua, in bible pictures, commentaries, art, etc. where of a white man with questionable sexuality. Why do you think that is? The KJV has obvious "strange" translations that are inconsistent with anciet hebrew language (which is scientifically linquisticly an ancient African langauge). Why is there little mention of Afric in the Bible (since it origniated from African peoples)? Why is this?

Just because something was PURE going in, doesn't mean it was PURE going out. A person cannot explain or interpret God beyond their cultural world view unless they have been exposed to many other world views and experiences. What ever God puts in your spirit STILL has to be processed neurologically by a human brain. Again, scribes wrote for many of these prophets, and some of the writings strangely appeared after their demise. Don't you think it just a tad bit strange thatthe bible was supposedly written in hebrew, and from the hebrew, the NT translated to greek, and from greek to english---yet we cannot seem to get our hands on one shred of the original texts? So who has the stuff that the bible was translated from? Who owns it --because it is not available to us "common' folks or scholars? The KJV only came about in 1611--it is a VERSION, not a direct translation. The preface of the older KJV will tell you that it is the KING of ENGLAND's VERSION. A version is never truth--it is tainted by the one telling it.

Also, it is doubtful that Moses actually wrote the Pentateuch. Much of these stories can be found in the Ancient Egyptian Book (later the name of it was changed to make us steer away from it to the Ancient Egyptian Book of the Dead). Some of the stories are quite identical, and predates the so-called writings of Moses by at least 4000 years. This isn't hard to figure out that Moses got his stuff from there because he was raised there as royalty in the Pharoah's house. Thus, he was steeped in the religious traditions of Egypt of Africa.

It is not that God could not make people write correctly. He usually does not use coersion as a tactic. I honestly believe that His word is PURE and PERFECT but the vessels are often not perfect, though they be holy. I do believe that God inspired (not wrote Himself) holy men and women of God. He should thereforestill be inspirign people with His word today because He does not change. If He did, then Jesus would be in violation bedause He always had a fresh revelation. Who could have been any more inspired than he--yet he wrote not a single book (that we know of). He taught revelation of what had been written as there is nothing new under the sun. We must continue to do this today, as Israel's history is just that--THEIR history. The word must be made relveant to all people, all cultures and all generations.

The fact is, the KJV is laiden with inconsistencies, poor translations and transliterations. Part of this may be because from Hebrew to Greek are many words for which there were NO Greek and English equivalents to so we had to fill it the blanks. Bro. John, have you ever looked in your KJV to see HOW many words are in italics? These words are not in teh original langauge and were supplied by the authors to make the thing culrually make sense.

As far as the flood--I am suggesting that the writers were NOT AWARE that the earth was round and had another whole side to it unbeknownst to them. So either the whole earth for them was the whole continent, OR the brothers slept with their sisters to reproduce--but check out your bible--one of Noah's sons TOOK a wife AFTER the flood--so WHO was it, if there was NO body left on the face of the earth.

Here's a link--if you are mature in your faith enough to handle this. Some of it leaves room to be desired, but there is definitely some truth to these articles.
Good Books are Nana Darkwah's Africans who Wrote the Bible, the Myth of Genisis and Exodus by Yosef benJochannan (this dude is sometimes way out there, but he raises excellent question and poses some pretty insightful answers). Try this link if you dare to explore beyond what you were MADE to believe (even in the face of obvious obsceneties.

http://www.awitness.org/contrabib/torah/moses.html

Oh, also satan would not try to contiminate scripture to confuse us, but he, through corrupt flesh would do it to CONTROL us-and that is exactly what has happened. The first time I heard a pastor preach from Ghana, he said, "Christians are the DUMBEST people in the world...because they have been brainwashed to believe ANY thing and paralyzed from thinking and inquiring (this is a God given skill). I started to get offended, but the HolyGhost put me in check and told me to just hear him out. When he began to point out the obvious mistranslations and things that were added to the bible that older translations do not even have. I find that he is right. We believe nearly anything we were told by the owners of the biblical tradition, without even questioning, much less studying to dig for answers (or to dig for more questions, if need be).



check the link if you like, or if not--it's cool also.

talk to you later.

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

I think you're right, we may have broke the reply button. Or maybe we're being monitored, or maybe it's been fixed so that way we'll have to listen to each other more dilligently.

I have read Nawakha's book, well some of it, I'm reading through it now. He doesn't substantiate too much of it does he?
Oh... yes I see no I SEE the Duet. 28 connection now! See what humility and agreeability gets you!

I too feel like the righteous may not all be church goers, or even partakers in recognized Christianity for that matter. (I guess we'll start a riot together lol )

[Adrian Lamar West Sr.]

My brother,
I in know way want you or any other too believe/think that I suppose to know everything, or anything for that matter.
But a reply too the questions you asked the Bishop answered one .
My response shall be It is just a sign O' the times. Do not be dismayed, rather stay on the battlefield and keep fighting for the right.
With Love for you my man,
Min. west

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

Speaking of Sign of the Times, have you seen that video of the guy who has people getting 666 tatooes? He claims to be the anti-Christ and preaches that there is no sin. Wow, as Prince says Sign of the Times.

Check out Cornell West's CD, you may like it!