Calling All Preachers

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

All right, let me be straight foward here. No one has an affinity for preaching particualry sermonic celebration then me! Well save maybe Rev. Dr. M.J. Simmons who is currently writting the much anticipated anthology on Black preaching. She is the quenn of Black preaching! With that being said I need to post a serious series of questions:

1.) How can one know when there sermon was effective? I mean really ought we assess our sermonic success via congregational interaction? Is it likeley that people can even really concentrate and commit to memory our life shaping discourse while screaming back "Amen" and "Say it" to us while simultaneously tapping, slapping and touching their neighbor? Moreover, all of us I dare say it have at some point either played church, watched kids play church, or have playfully chit-chatted about church enough to know that we can all feign, fake or play shout. What's to say that congregants don't do the same? Perhaps many are just conditioned to respond to certain organ chords, certain tonal inflections, and perhaps much of the pandemonium praise we elicit through sermon is crowd influenced mob behavior? In short, I am asking my brothers and sisters for a viable means for assessing the sermonic task, by viable I mean a tangible observable means, while I do beleive after doing the deed it ought to "be well with one's soul" in this petition however, I am calling for more than that.

2.)Speaking of celebration and it's effectiveness at eliciting emotive response from a congregation, I feel the need to pose this question: when is enough.....well enough? Do you beleive it is possible to over do it?

3.)Is it a sermon if I do not go to Golgotha and close at the cross? What If I am preaching from the Hebrew Scriptures? Or preaching in the Advent season, must I always hasten to the cross? I admit, I love hearing the passion narrative and I am planning on having 1 Cor. 2:2 inked indeliably on my body, so no one is more cross crazy than yours truly, however, I feel the need to raise this relevant question, is a sermon salvific if it has no mention of the cross. Let me give a bit more insight as to why this issue is a concern for me. In Christ I beleive God reconciled the world to God's self. No doubt, however the atonemnet theory (Jesus' death for our sins) is but one of the many ways of talking about Jesus' redemptive tenure here on earth. Might we as preachers find other salvific means of expressing God's love for us by preaching the full gospel. By full gospel I mean the multitude of ways in which God saves us! I am not dismissing the cross, not even, but what I am doing is pushing for us as preachers to take God and God's gospel out of the box we've cognitively configured to put Him in. I am hoping that we can open our eyes, ears, minds and spirits to the Holy Spirit that He may direct us into a fuller understanding of the significance of Christ's life. I beleive that there is much salvation in the birth, life, death, and Ressurection of Jesus! I am disheartened that we often Jesus' significance to one defining moment in time.

Your comments, questions, considerations are wanted, welcomed, and warrented

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

drats....waht can be said.....If I speak honestly, you will say that I am berating you! I appreciate your enthusiasm and your zest, I mean you are jolly on the spot bumping for brother John, who I did not insult! I appreciate your wise words toward the end of your spill. They have not fallen uppon death ears. I agree with you revelation does come through prayer! Yes it does but man you ain't the 1st person to sit with a Bible and pray for darn near two millinia or so folk been doing it!!! And what God gave them they wrote it down so excuse me if God got me Feenin' like Jodeci and I can't get enough understanding of God!

My brother, there is soooooooo much to learn, the KJV wasn't created until 1619 I believe, what in the world do you think folks used before then? No Augustine isn't in the biblical text, but He is a founding father of the church. Much of what we do and believe is because of what he wrote many years ago. He struggled with things that we take for granted as doctrine!

I have not nor do I intend to utilize this space as a soundboard for boasting of cognition, nor one upmanship. I really want to hear you and for you to hear me. My prayer is that of Christ's that we may all be 1.
Yeah you and I are as different as night and day, but neither is better, both are created as divisions of time. I never have asserted to be better, but perhaps it is coming across as if I am boastful. Or perhaps in the tradition of the Black church our gripe is with the fact that I am educated. At any rate, school as I said earliers was a prerequisite I took the initiative to persue to better avail myself to God, and I am SOOOOO glad I did! My relationship is sooooo much better for it. I know have tools that God uses at His leisure to paint better brighter and bigger pictures of Him than I did b4 school. I ain't knockin anyone else, this is just my experience.

Oh and wisdom never comes from being educated, it's God given. Experience is the best teacher, but even the best teachers can only teach those who learn from them. Thus experience is nothing if you haven't learned from it! Being old sometimes just means you're old. You know like me tht there are young fools just like there are old fools and as granny says ain't nothing wotse than an old fool!
By no means am I even remotely saying you're a fool just simply reiterating that we all have something to offer. Stop trying to discount me for loving God and trying to learn as much as possible about Him. I am being a good steward with the brain He gave me.

FYI you ain't heard your favorite Psalms until you've read them in the Message Bible! just try it you don't know what you're missing! P.S. you won't go to hell for reading a Bible, nor will you become a heretic, or demon, or anything else. Come who would prevent you from learning from the AaWord in a language you understand and naturally speak? Satan that's who!

[Adrian Lamar West Sr.]

many times our srmons are effective by the negative response, the nay-sayers. When Jesus, the Apostles and the prophets spake , many times it was met with resentment. So there are many reponses too our sermons, I personally love too hear the negative/ as well as the positive. The sermon does different things, the parable of the sower is an great example; the word encourages, discourages, builds up and tearsdown, equips, un-equips, saves and cuts it's losses. While we ourselves must cleanse ourselves of self-gratification, and welcome the Lord to using us as he sees fit, then we and our works are not in vain.
I personally believe that we must at some point in our discourses must preach the message of salvation, The cross was not in Jonahs time/ yet salvation was. the cross and it's significance came with the fulfilling of the law. We cannot preach nor teach of Jesus and his significance without the Cross. It, the cross ( death burial and resurrection) are the most important of his moments, without the shedding of his blood there would be no remission of our sins.

there is no other way too salvation but through the cross. Can't get too god without first going through Christ.
Preaching has become too much of an art form instead of a way of communicating the truth, forget filling the pughs, and let's go about filling the hearts and changing the minds.
One thing must need be and that is a simple message of Christ, usage of all the metaphors, and quotes aren't really necessary, a simple and plain explanation shall do.

[Bishop S. JaNine Hyman, Ph.D.]

P.S. Brother West-- I say DITTO there....ain't THAT the truth. You are so right--preaching has become such an art form. There is a sicence and an art to preaching--Jesus and the prophets perfected it. But this stuff we have today is so far from Gdo until the people are almost completely alienated from Him.

Bishop

[Adrian Lamar West Sr.]

Bishop, would love too chat with you, but gotta go/ if you have time, tantalk1340.com/ 6:00-7:00a.m/7:30-8:00a.m est.
minister

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

I believe that preaching is an artform. Like Bishop says Jesus mastered it! What I hear now is a lot of motivational speeches and self help sermons. Stuff aimed directly at hitting emotional nerves. It does not heal it only gives a quick fix. I believe that there is salvation in only 1 name......
Yet I believe that God's salvation transpires more than at Calvary. There is salvation in the manger, salvation on the stormy sea, and salvation at a Samaritain well to name a few. No this salvation was not eschatological or the final salvation we're all awating when Gabriel will sound the horn and the dead in Christ rise...... you know were I'm going but salvation in the sense of saving, rescuing, making whole. What do you think, is it necessary to go to the cross under these circumstances or will by me doing so cause me to miss some other vital aspects?
(This is the kind of conversations I'm into. Not at each others throats.... Peace man Peace)

[Adrian Lamar West Sr.]

Wow! Jesus mastered an artform, yall are really reaching. The Bible clearly speaks of what you are saying , but if one preaches by any other means than the Power, then they have run amiss. Salvation, when the Angel was pronouncing that the Savior was too be born he was quoted as saying "HIS NAME SHALL BE CALLED JESUS, FOR HE WILL SAVE HIS PEOPLE FROM THEIR SINS"
You want Eschatologics, stay in school. Man calls it eschatology, divinity, theology. But the word is true. Funny how people who were denied the simple things in life knew God, The Pharisees, were educated, yet they were hard-hearted and scandalous. Purity is what is needed, truth can only come from one who knows it. Haven't you noticed there are many different opinions about religion and such, And for the most part people deny the simplicity of the whole matter. If you are speaking on your own you are already missing vital aspects, but once you decrease and god increases you will not miss anything. can you feel it!

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

you can say what you want but sermons are artistic. Jesus' preaching was masterful! It was and remains a thing of beauty. He mastered the craft of speaking to audiences. He used parables, questions, and object lessons all to teach truth to His followers. To tell a story is an art my brother, and the stories Jesus told are masterpieces.

As for preaching with power, oh yeah you have to do that, for it is ultimately the Holy Spirit that convicts and brings knoweledge of God, however, the Holy Spirit is at work on the preacher way before the sermon is preached. The Spirit should be invoked and invited in the preperation process! That is if the sermon is too have power. I believe that when we allow the Spirit to have His way He births fresh ways of presenting timeless truths to people stuck in time!
The best preachers are able to take really terse topics and explain them easily, an or shed light on familiar texts. Ultimately they compell us to draw closer to God.

Yes there are many debates about religion. Religion is simple and complex all at the same time. I enjoy religious discussion and even religious debate. I bet you do too, because you sure do a lot of it on this sight. All we can do is debate religion, because at the end of the day we don't really know. The moment we think we know, we are leaning on our own understanding, and thus are not using faith. We are saved by grace alone not works (religion is a work and so is theology, and so are our contrived doctrines). Our feable attempts to grasp the Almighty are just that feable attempts. All that matters in the end is belief and acknowledgement. Does it get any simpler than that?

I want to adress your concerns by posing a question. It is one I hear erupting from your comment. How much of the preaching task is our responsibility? ( I believe this will be my next forum!) I believe that we are like tools in God's tool belt. Ultimately He does the work, he just uses us to get the job done and when He wants to use us to perform a task (deliver a sermon) we owe it to Him to be oiled up, sharp, and ready to go!
With this model the focus is not on the preacher but the one who wields the preacher, the preacher is just a tool. The tools job is just to be at his or her best! Thus when I a tool have a text I am to spend ample time in sermon prep under the unction of the Spirit who opens up the text and me too see and hear and feel it anew. I can feel that!

[John]

Brother Harris, Amen to your statements and our wasteful time trying to figure God out. We can't period. He gives us His understanding and not us giving ourselves the understanding of Him with our shallow understanding. Our foolishness is explained very well by God in 1 Cor 1:21, 23, 25; 1 Cor 2:14 and 1Cor 3:19.

We are save by grace and not of our works for sure because none of us are worthy. It could only come from the grace of God that we are saved. And again I say I feel you when you say the Spirit has to have moved you before your sermon and I've been to sermons as stated before when that sermon was about the one giving it or stories and not the Word and I was not fed. Don't get me wrong I feel we do need ministers and those that are blessed by God to help and edify we laypersons but those ministers have to be of God and not of themselves or of satan and we do have those. No one will ever convince me that everyone that stands on the pulpit is of God and I don't apologize for my statement. Judas walked with and was taught personally by our Lord and Saviour and satan was all in him. There we other disciples that changed Jesus meaning to fit and suit their own needs and it didnt' stop with them, it's still going on today. I feel (my own personal feeling and we know what opinions are like but) we need ministers to stand up and recognize this and stop some paternity attitude that everything is OK. It's not OK. The Spirit isn't in everyone standing on the pulpit or everyone sitting in the pughs! It has been my being fed that has brought me closer to God and I feel my sincerity of wanting His understanding, wisdom and knowledge, shutting down mine as much as I can and letting go and letting God. Thank you for your post.\

By the way and I really know this will probably get me banned from BPN but I want to know and get an understanding and it's in my heart to get it and I feel God has put it there so I'm gonna ask just like I always do. I want to start a post about the feelings of Masons and if they are of God or satan! Just like I received no response to my questions of "Are We All Related" and wondered if the no response has something to do with our own racisms that we can't let go. Also I have a discussion about "Speaking in/with Tongues" that no one wants to respond to. I'm not trying to come in with easy warm fuzzy stuff as you attested to. That's not me. I don't care about warm fuzzy can't we all just get along stuff. I'm not trying to pretend that all is well because it isn't. I'm like the two year old that wants to know and learn. God bless you all.

[Bishop S. JaNine Hyman, Ph.D.]

Min. West, woud you not consider the fact that Jesus spoke using metaphors and parables? Is this not the atristic use of words to create a divine message that people either understand or are offended at? I don't think it's a reach at all to say that preaching is both an art (this part comes from divine inspiration and oratorical gifting), and a science (this comes from study). It takes knowledge, wisdom, revelation, inspiration AND skill to be able to reach a wide spectrum of listeners at different levels, and with different psychological and developmental issues.

The prophets of old often spoke in poetic prose, psalms, and spiritual hymns: These are all art forms. God is the Author and Genius of both art and science. Therefore it would stand to reason that the more one taps into the mind and heart of God, he or she will replicate the Great Genius of Heaven and Earth, the Omniscient (Omni-SCIENCE) God.

Bishop

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

BISHOP!!!! nYou are so eloquent and sooo deep! I love when you post. Bless you and the God whom you serve.

[Bishop S. JaNine Hyman, Ph.D.]

Ah, my dear Brother, thanks for the vote of confindence. It means so much to me. On the "fa-real, fa-real", I don't be trying to be deep....it's just the realm of God in which I live (so since it's a realm that I occupy--it ain't mine, and I, therefore, can't take credit for it). I'm still trying to go deeper into the mysteries of God since as His Apostle, I must be steward over these mysteries. I want to be so deeply embedded into the mind and heart of God that I am unmoved by the systems of this western world which generate and house religion, Christianity, church, and ministry. How you like dem apples? (lol).

What's the "J" for in your middle name? I suspect that your nature and ministry will shift from the meaning of Napoleon in the coming years to the meaning of your middle name. I can't wait to see what God will do with you.

Happy Thanksgiving Brother Preacher--blessings upon your quest for truth and upon your every obedience.

love and prayers,
bishop h.

[Napoleon J. Harris V]

For some unforseen reason the last comment you made doesn't give us the opportunity to reply. So wanna-hear-it here it goes.

1.) The middle name is actually fictitious, I don't have a middle name. The J. is actually a nicknmae and everyone from back home calls me "Jay" which is short for Jr. So the nickname stuck and people really believe my name is Napoleon Jay Harris, so I just roll with it, besides how else would I get my shirts monogrammed when I get my mega-church (lol) really lol!!! So if my ministry shifts it will be in the area of people... because that's who gave me that name the people. I love God so I gotta love His people.

2.) I apologize for my fiestiness of tone and to you for having to rebuke me. I'm you ng, but old school enough to know how to lay low and respect my elders. I have no excuses, however, I have a rational for being so spirited. I have an utter disdain in my soul whenever, we attempt to give easy answers for things. Following God is easy and complicated, yes at times we make it complicated, but it''s also hard. Thus the need for faith. If we knew the will of God we'd need no faith. It's like this I love people, and I hate when we hurt them from the pulpit saying un-rational things like God wanted it that way, or it was God's will when people face the loss of loved ones or any loss. I am specifically speaking to what William "Bill" Coffin spoke of in the eulogy of his son. (This sermon is world widely acclaimed and its called Alex's Death. You can Google it.) I think we hurt people when we give candy coated answers to problems that seer and go down bitter like castor and cod liver oil cocktails. I have known many to be ran away from God and church because of our uncritical and readymade answers which never honor the occasion or the individual(s) in peril.
I took Min. West's words completely out of context. He never asserted to know the mind of God only that he knew scriptures. He supposes scriptures to be the mind of God. I can dig that, but even they are only dimly lit peek hole glimpses into the eternity that is God. They need revelation and even with that our only sneek previews of the God too come. I may have went overboard in my discourse and have been to chiding in my rhethoric but it's just frustration. I have long grown weary of human arrogance in heavenly matters. We ought fess up and say it. I DON"T KNOW!!!! But I know who does know. Those who hasten to give answers are they not scratching itching ears? Where is the faith factor? Can we not just admit that we are not for certain, and that while we can not bid God's hand we can bet on it. Can we not be happy with knowing that while we can not trace God we can trust God, and have the faith as W. Pannenburg ( I can't recall the spelling) that through it all God is pulling humanity closer to him? Nevertheless no more soapboxing at least not today (lol) for me. And your point is crystal clear.

3.) I need you to say more on how Duet. 28 coincides with chattel slavery! How did our ancestors disobey God? Are you referring to the Akan people who are believed to have migrated there and have comprised the biblical Israel? Where they unfaithful in the revelation of God they had? Or are you speaking of the proported heathanism of the indigenous Africans? I am not disputing you, I just need more information so that we can be in unison of thought, you know let me see it how you see it and then I can learn something. I visited your church's page and so I know that you're up on African culture so teach me something.

4.) Yes, I am a proud member to the only Black College fraternity. The 1st Black frat founded on a Black college campus. The frat whose founding fathers boast a Bishop, a doctor, a physics scholar, and a brother so bad they had to commemorate him on a stamp!!!
I am a part of THE Omega Psi Phi Fraternity Inc.
on the Charter Line of the Owtrageous, Owtlandish, OwtStanding Omega Lambda Lambda Chapter!!!!!!

What tipped you? We a