The Trinity is Bibical

[Rev. Derek Joshua E'Lon]

Is The Trinity Biblical?
From the Christian Research Institute
www.equip.org
The Trinity is a basic doctrine of orthodox Christianity. Yet the word "Trinity" is not found anywhere in the Bible. Is the doctrine of the Trinity really biblical?
The doctrine of the Trinity says that there is one All Mighty One (God) who exists eternally as three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I can assure you that the elements of this doctrine are all taken directly from the Bible.
The first plank of the Trinitarian platform is that there is only one All Mighty One (God). The Bible could not be more explicit on this point, which it states explicitly about two dozen times. In Isaiah 44:8 Yahweh (The LORD) says that even He does not know of any other (mighty ones)gods!
Yahshua (Jesus) often spoke of the All Mighty One (God) as His Father, and the apostles frequently spoke of "the Almighty One (God) the Father." But the New Testament also insists that Yahshua (Jesus) is The Almighty One (God). For example, Thomas acknowledged Yahshua (Jesus) as, "My Lord(master) and my Almighty One (God)" (John 20:28), and both Peter and Paul spoke of Yahshua (Jesus) as "our All Mighty One (God) and Savior" (2 Pet. 1:1; Tit. 2:13). Yet the New Testament also makes the distinction between the Father and the Son as two very different persons. In fact they tell us that they love one another, speak to each other, and seek to glorify each other (e.g., John 17: 1-26).
The Old Testament refers often to the Holy Spirit as The Almighty One (God) at work in the world, without distinction from the Father. But Yahshua (Jesus) in John 14 to 16 explained that this Holy Spirit would be sent by the Father at the Messiah’s (Christ's) request. The Holy Spirit would teach and guide the disciples, not speaking on His own initiative, but speaking on the Messiah’s 9Christ's) behalf and glorifying The messiah (Christ). Thus, the Holy Spirit is revealed by The Messiah (Christ) to be a third person distinct from the Father and distinct from the Son.
In short, the doctrine of the Trinity is completely and totally biblical, and it is essential that all the Followers of the Messiah Yahshua (Christians) give assent to this doctrine.

[HOPE - Psalm 43:5]

First let me say that I posted this chapter because I wanted to see who would pick and choose the verses that would suppport their opinion. John chapter 14 could be used by both sides pulling on the rope of ONE GOD in this tug of war conversation of ours.

Bro Germain - Let's see you asked me some direct questions so I should answer them directly.

You asked me to explain verse 17

John 14:17 - Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you".

This can be explained by reading further down the chapter...

John 14:23 - Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Bro Germain, next you quoted Paul:

Galatians 2:20
"I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me".

Ok stick with the verse you quoted -- I live by faith in the Son of God

Now add a touch of John 3:16 to the Galatians 2:20 scripture that you quoted – for God so love the world that He sent His only begotten Son so that whosoever believes in Him will have everlasting life.


Bro Germain, you erroneously deduced that there was an error in my pre-supposition by asking this question:

Do the Holy Spirit and Jesus Christ represent TWO PERSONS who live in each believer?

Well, let’s hang out in Galatians for minute:

Galatians 4:4-6
4But when the fullness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

6And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

Does this contradict what is written in John 14??

I love sarcasm, and use it often so I appreciate your statement when you said:

I realize that before believing in the doctrine of the Holy Trinity, one must be first a learned sage, a very good scientist: 1+1= 2

Jesus Christ + Holy Spirit = TWO PERSONS

However, the true Church of Jesus Christ receives the truth by revelation, by faith, by the Holy Spirit: This truth is as follows: 1+1= 1

Jesus Christ+ Holy Spirit= ONE PERSON

My response would be:

Why would such a great mathematician add when there is only 1? Why create any type of equation? Why add 1 + 1??? Why not just say one? Has anyone here said that there is more than ONE God?


Now sticking with John chapter 14, I must ask what is happening in verse 26?

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


Oh by the way, if you notice that I have stopped answering after some time, it is only because I've "let go of the rope" that I should have avoided in the first place. (Titus 3:9)

[Caral]

Way to go!! Minister Tracy, and Bro. Germain said that you didn't know your scriptures!

[N'ZI Amani Germain]

Sister Tracy,

You said:

"...Has anyone here said that there is more than ONE God?"

So we all agree that there is ONE GOD. But, that is not the question.

The Question lies in the fact that you fail to explain clearly your following theory:

"THREE PERSONS IN GOD"

And your common answer to that question is:

The holy Trinity is a mystery, nothing more, nothing less!

If that mystery has been revealed to you, then you must be able to explain it in light of the Holy Scriptures.

Father = one Person

The Son = one Person

Holy Spirit = one person

Father is God + Holy Spirit is God + The Son is God = THREE PERSONS = ONE God

One God + One God+ One God = THREE PERSONS = ONE God

Trinitarians fail to explain this difficult and absurd equation.

Is this the creed of the earlier Church?

No! The Holy Bible doesn't support this satanic doctrine.

What a funny doctrine!

Blessings,

Bro. Germain

[N'ZI Amani Germain]

Very good!

Dear sister Tracy,

Can you explain me the verse 17 of John Chapter 14 ?

"Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you".

"...AND SHALL BE IN YOU..."?

Besides, Brother Paul said:

"I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me".

Galatians 2:20

"...BUT CHRIST LIVES IN ME..."

Do the Holy Spirit and Jesus Christ represent TWO PERSONS who live in each believer?

No, Trinity is the scientific(mathematic) approach of the Holy Scriptures.

A true believer will recognize that "...whoever is united with the Lord is one with him in spirit"(1 Corinthians 6:17).

Thus, the Holy Spirit is nothing but the Spirit of Jesus Christ. We are not in the presence of two persons of the so calkled Trinity, but we see here One person, namely Jesus Christ, living in the believers by His Spirit, the Holy Spirit.

I realize that before believing in the doctrine of the Holy Trinity, one must be first a learned sage, a very good scientist: 1+1= 2

Jesus Christ + Holy Spirit = TWO PERSONS

However, the true Church of Jesus Christ receives the truth by revelation, by faith, by the Holy Spirit: This truth is as follows: 1+1= 1

Jesus Christ+ Holy Spirit= ONE PERSON

This truth hardly hurts the logic of the Trinitarians.

Sister Tracy, I'm waiting for your answer.

Bro. Germain

[N'ZI Amani Germain]

An other food for thought:

"11Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake".

John 14:11

Bro. Germain

[Child of the Kingdom]

Of course many have read this passage. If you look a little closer, Jesus actually gives a clue in the verses below. When Philip said show us the father and Jesus all but told them they were looking at him (smile)

8. Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

10. Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

11. Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.

JESUS GIVE CLUES THAT HE IS THE FATHER. I POSTED A FORUM THAT GIVES MANY SUPPORTING SCRIPTURES THAT JESUS INTENTIONALLY HID HIS IDENTITY AS THE FATHER.

http://abcpreachers.ning.com/forum/topics/jesus-is-the-father-but

JESUS MAKES IT KNOWN THAT THE IDENTITY OF THE FATHER IS HIDDEN

John 16:25

25. These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.

I BELIEVE THIS PASSAGE DISPROVES THE TRINITY.

[N'ZI Amani Germain]

AMEN!

Where are the numerous Trinitarians of the B.N.P. ?

Please, do not leave sister Tracy and sister Caral alone! They are innocent. They don't know the Holy Scriptures.

So please, come and rescue them for your DOCTRINE is in danger...!

Bro. Germain

[Child of the Kingdom]

JESUS IS THE FATHER ..... BUT PURPOSELY HID THAT FACT THROUGH PROVERBS, PARABLES AND DARK SPEECHES

KEEP IN MIND, THERE IS BUT ONE LORD

Ephesians 4:5

5. One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

6. One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Zechariah 14:9

9. And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

SHOWS JESUS AS THE LORD

Romans 6:11
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Thessalonians 3:11
Now God himself and our Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, direct our way unto you.

Thessalonians 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God, even our Father, which hath loved us, and hath given us everlasting consolation and good hope through grace

SHOWS THE FATHER AS THE LORD

Isaiah 63:16
Doubtless thou art our father, though Abraham be ignorant of us, and Israel acknowledge us not: thou, O LORD, art our father, our redeemer; thy name is from everlasting.

Isaiah 64:8
But now, O LORD, thou art our father; we are the clay, and thou our potter; and we all are the work of thy hand.

THE MYSTERY OF THE FATHER’S IDENTITY UNRAVELING

Isaiah 9:6
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

John 14:8-9

8. Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9. Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

AH HAH!!

JESUS MAKES IT KNOWN THAT THE IDENTITY OF THE FATHER IS HIDDEN

John 16:25

25. These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.

SUPPORTING SCRIPTURES

Malachi 2:10

10. Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?

Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes

Luke 10:21
In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in

Deuteronomy 10:17
For the LORD your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:

WHO SENT THE COMFORTER JESUS OR THE FATHER ?

JESUS SPEAKING

John 16:7

7. Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

JESUS SPEAKING

John 14:26

26. But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

1 Timothy 3:16

16. And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Numbers 12:8

With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?

CONCLUSION - JESUS IS THE FATHER - BUT PURPOSELY HID THAT FACT THROUGH PROVERBS, PARABLES AND DARK SPEECHES

[N'ZI Amani Germain]

Sister Tracy,

You said:

"...Has anyone here said that there is more than ONE God?"

So we all agree that there is ONE GOD. But, that is not the question.

The Question lies in the fact that you fail to explain clearly your following theory:

"THREE PERSONS IN GOD"

And your common answer to that question is:

The holy Trinity is a mystery, nothing more, nothing less!

If that mystery has been revealed to you, then you must be able to explain it in light of the Holy Scriptures.

Father = one Person

The Son = one Person

Holy Spirit = one person

Father is God + Holy Spirit is God + The Son is God = THREE PERSONS = ONE God

One God + One God+ One God = THREE PERSONS = ONE God

Trinitarians fail to explain this difficult and absurd equation.

Is this the creed of the earlier Church?

No! The Holy Bible doesn't support this satanic doctrine.

What a funny doctrine!

Blessings,

Bro. Germain

[Child of the Kingdom]

We can safely assume that the Apostles are in Heaven so I will continue in the Apostles Doctrine and you all may continue in the Catholic Doctrine if you wish. But please consider your souls and don't be fooled by this false Doctrine of the Triune GodS. There are not 3 Gods. The way you all teach that there are 3 separate persons with 3 separate wills in completely not scriptural. The will of the father is the will of Jesus. They are one not separated. Many times, trinitarians don't even speak of the Holy Ghost at All. It sometimes sounds more like Unity than Trinity.

FOR THOSE WHO DON'T KNOW WHAT THE APOSTLES DOCTRINE IS YOU WILL FIND IT BELOW:

Acts 2:38-42 (King James Version)

38. Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the LORD our God shall call.

40. And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

41. Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

42. And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

[Archbishop Trevor 'Elihu' Greene]

Bro. Germain:

You said something very interesting that many Oneness doctrine adherents will avoid. You said "Give me the proof that the earlier Church had believed in your dogma."

I have given proof of such and yet it has not even been rejected, but TOTALLY IGNORED> However, I will answer this one back if you or anyone else are interested. People claim that this Trinitarian doctrine is a heresy from the Roman Catholic Church and the Council of Nicea (325 A.D.). Do any of the Oneness doctrine believes want to see what the Apostolic Fathers hundreds of years BEFORE Nicea had to say about the GODHEAD? If they aren't interested, do you at least want to see, Germain?

Oh I assure you, these men are not all from the Roman Catholic Church. In fact very few are. We can trace it backward from 325 AD all the way to around 100 A.D. if you are up for it (keep in mind that the Book of Revelation was written around 90 A.D. and the Temple destroyed in 70 A.D.). However, I won't place the info up there if you are ready to run from it.......

[Child of the Kingdom]

I am interested in any scriptures that you have showing that the Apostles also taught the Trinity Doctrine.